Songwriter Group Build -- Not Gonna Happen

[Littlewyan]

Just what we need! Which supplier do you get these from cbass? And do they use their own crane on delivery?

[Teleguy61]

Not taking sides but Hogy is right here, this has been a common issue across the board for years. Although in my opinion its not as big as an issue as people think, a lot of amps have survived for years without having a Standby Switch replaced and I suspect the Komets will survive for years without having the Fast/Gradual Switch replaced.

Like I said, not taking sides, just pointing something out.

As I said, I understand this completely.

[Zippy]

Oh please.
My switch is bigger than your switch?
Seriously?

You're not understanding any of this.

The point is, the DC rating of commonly used switches is very low. Yet, every amp manufacturer in history has used them as standby switches to switch B+ (DC) well in excess of 10 or 15 times their rating.

If a 125V/15A NKK switch is rated at 30VDC, what do you think a 6A Mountain switch is rated at? or a 2A Carling switch as used by Fender for decades? Yet somehow they held up.

Current becomes the issue - particularly the make/break surges. Both voltage and current are devalued and interdependent. What is the DC current passing through these switches in this application?

That is why they have lasted so long.

Now that the switch issue has been addressed, perhaps you could respond to this more on-topic question. Maybe you missed it before.

Could we consider an alternative take on this thread?

Komet still pays royalties for that circuit. You're not only stealing from me, you're stealing from Ken Fischer's family. The guy you all respect so much, remember? "Kenny"?


And that about sums it up,

Hogy

What would be an appropriate royalty for a builder to provide to the Fischer family for a "tribute" amplifier? What percentage of your profits do you pay?

[Hogy]

[quote="Zippy"

Now that the switch issue has been addressed, perhaps you could respond to this more on-topic question. Maybe you missed it before.

Could we consider an alternative take on this thread?

Komet still pays royalties for that circuit. You're not only stealing from me, you're stealing from Ken Fischer's family. The guy you all respect so much, remember? "Kenny"?


And that about sums it up,

Hogy

What would be an appropriate royalty for a builder to provide to the Fischer family for a "tribute" amplifier? What percentage of your profits do you pay?

I'm not going to answer that. Part one of your question is for the Fischer family to determine,. Part two is, no disrespect, none of your business.

[Zippy]

What would be an appropriate royalty for a builder to provide to the Fischer family for a "tribute" amplifier? What percentage of your profits do you pay?

I'm not going to answer that. Part one of your question is for the Fischer family to determine,. Part two is, no disrespect, none of your business.

You brought up the issue of paying a fair amount for building the amps. I'm just trying to seek some parity.

[Mark]

While we have Hogy's attention I've wondered what the story is with Mark Knopfler. He was a big Ken Fischer fan, then he's using Komet and then he settles on using Reinhardt amps. One amp in particular was very Rocket like with a mid control.

[Allynmey]

Now that the switch issue has been addressed, perhaps you could respond to this more on-topic question. Maybe you missed it before.

Actually no it hasn't. For a number of years Hogy has come to this site telling us "stop copying others amps." or "why don't you improve upon a design rather than copy someone else's"

The switch reference if you read it, had a few comments. One being the fact that the user had to shut off the amp, switch the fast/gradual switch, and turn it back on if he wanted to switch modes. I believe I mentioned reaching around a hot amp in the dark. That makes the feature practically useless in a live situation.
Mark, Dana, and I come up with a great solution to use a noiseless, popless, live switcher that is pedal driven that people have embraced. Dave Friedman and I collaborated on a circuit change to help with low end roll.
I would consider both a significant "upgrade" to the original offering.
So with that in mind, I guess we did what you said in the long run. Again, I say "your welcome".

on the other point, there's a reason you tell people not to switch the fast/gradual mode when the amp id live...and I doubt it because of the horrendous pop!

[Hogy]

While we have Hogy's attention I've wondered what the story is with Mark Knopfler. He was a big Ken Fischer fan, then he's using Komet and then he settles on using Reinhardt amps. One amp in particular was very Rocket like with a mid control.

Mark Knopfler still uses his Komets, this video is just a few months old:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kqcSWOYUE-Q

Dave Friedman and I collaborated on a circuit change to help with low end roll.

Here's Pete Thorn's (sinasl1 on TGP) first hand account on how the mod came about:

http://www.thegearpage.net/board/showth ... p?t=517175


Somehow Pete forgot to mention that you were there as well.

[pdf64]

When switching dc, what matters is that the switch has a quick make / break action, see p6 (p4 of the paper) http://www.aeroelectric.com/Reference_D ... Manual.pdf

and note http://www.carlingtech.com/sites/defaul ... _COS_0.pdf

I don't think that slow make / break switches would be suitable, even if rated for comparatively large ac currents.

[David Root]

Thanx pdf64, these links answered a lot of ?? I had regarding use of AC switches on tube B+ voltages.

Even so, it seems no-one uses quick acting DC switches...too expensive??

[pdf64]

I think that the regular Carling SPST eg 110-63 traditionally used for power and standby is quick make / break, see http://www.datasheets360.com/pdf/1977147183663097080
Even though standby switches act on circuits well above 250V, historically they're probably proven suitable for our application.

Bear in mind that to meet approvals / certification for use as a line switch, they must be able to cope with repeated transients from lightning strikes on the distribution system. The protection systems can only take so much energy out of such events.
So the voltage switches can withstand across their terminals is probably way above guitar amp B+, though it'll probably be above the voltage they're rated to switch.

Some good discussion on this topic at MEF http://music-electronics-forum.com/t38483/

[Mark]

I was curious about the Komet switching mods and wondered what was probable.

Here is as far as I can tell this is the original post about the electronic switch from Allyn. The post date is the 28th of May 2008.

Peter Thorn's post is dated 03-04-2009. It would have been interesting to know what Friedman did to the Komet that impressed Pete Thorn so much?

http://ampgarage.com/forum/viewtopic.ph ... ght=switch

[Richie]

As mark posted the dates, I think if anyone does a search here, you can find the info..
So...

Here's Pete Thorn's (sinasl1 on TGP) first hand account on how the mod came about:

http://www.thegearpage.net/board/showth ... p?t=517175


Somehow Pete forgot to mention that you were there as well.

Do you think that Dave may have known what to do to Petes amps, because their had been some mods done to prior amps?

As this info is taken from a thread here, and it would predate those mods done to Petes amps. And as you can see.. Allyn and Daves names were mentioned. As was the switch mod that Billy Yates put in an amp. Just do a simple search here and you can find the mod info.

here is a quote.

I got Allyn and Dave hooked up a year ago over this, so Allyn knows, Dave knows, and I believe Hogy & Mike @ Komet are doing it as well.

There are a couple of mods, one is a change of the bass cap, the other I can't remember....sorry.

Contact one of the above mentioned amp gurus.

[Mark]

Is this the mod you were referring to?

http://ampgarage.com/forum/viewtopic.ph ... sc&start=0

[David Root]

Thanx again pdf64, Carling 110-63 is what I use, I never noticed that in the specs before, guess I wasn't looking for it then.