New Komet

Express, Liverpool, Rocket, Dirty Little Monster, etc.

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RossH
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Re: New Komet

Post by RossH »

I want to (hopefully) add to this. I have never personally met Ken Fischer. I had the opportunity to talk with him on the phone for almost two hours one day. It was very interesting.

From a series of questions that day I felt that what Ken ultimately wants you to do is to connect with the art of amp building and look at it like cooking. EVERYTHING matters! Sure, there is a general schematic and a most-bang-for-your-buck methodology but that is only going to get you so far. And with this limited approach you will miss the finer point of cooking. Riding the edge if instability makes things highly sensitive. What are you looking for? What guitar do you play? What kind of music should it be tuned for? That sort of thing. This connectedness with the amp tuning is the cooking part of it and what we could refer to as the Trainwreck Experience or Trainwreck Spirit of things. Maybe that is cheesy, but you get my point. Just like cooking there are many ways to influence the outcome and there are a variety of ways to influence a meal. This is where Ken wants you to go.

Would Ken just give you gut shots of his amplifer? I don't think so. He would help you all day long...but in a "turn it back on you with a heavy dash of help and insight"... manner. He seems like he is promoting the experience of amp building, with heavy on the personal experimentation, and not passing you out a quick and ready answer. Maybe some people don't like that, but that is how he seemed. Nice and helpful, just not the final answer. It was an interesting and colorful conversation. I'm not trying to debate who's property it is after he sells it and how long is OK to do these things. I am just trying to paint in a little bit of the picture of who Ken is.

I pointed out the Bassman similarity and he retorted that it is completely different. "When you look close you will see that they are completely different." And as he talked I listened. He brought he on a journey through ideas that I hadn't thought of before. It was mostly just a MUCH closer look at things. Cursory is NOT the word here. :) Maybe that seems smoke-and-mirrors to some people. I don't know. He didn't seem that way. He wasn't in to giving you his schematic and showing you the guts. He was in to talking together and learning from each other. When I reported these conversations before I believe some people apparently felt he was "just being evasive". That is left for each person to determine. Wanting to see the pictures is a way to avoid the time and effort of personal growth and the effort that goes with it...and the EXPERIENCE that goes with it, and just get straight to the answer. Maybe it is a sign of our times...the quick answer. Maybe it has nothing to do with it.

In this sense of personal growth and creativity, ultimately, I don't think he minds THAT much having people see his pictures. He probable woudn't have done it himself though. Like he said...he doesn't mind you making a Trainwreck's for yourself (this is the spirit of cooking).

Keep in mind, if Ken could be making amps right now he would be. He has had CFIDS (chronic fatigue and immune dysfunction syndrome) for many years now and does not get around much. He said that he still makes maybe one or two a year and he has a list of hundreds (thousands?) of people on a "waiting list" that he will probably never get to. He mentioned that in the community when the Wrecks sell the owners often send him some money from the sale. He doesn't ask for this. Also, it is his touch that people want...still today. Here is cooking, again. "Make this taste better for me, Ken." When I was talking to him he was working on Richie Sambora and Mark Knopfler's Komet. I think Mark used it on his new album on many tracks. I haven't heard it. My point is that even with these circuits...he is still giving them a once over...whatever that may be...if anything. Why didn't Richie and Mark just use the stock Komet? They wanted Ken to give it a once over. Call him "golden ears". Call him a "medicine man". How about just calling him a man that has done an amazing amount of detailed analysis of the "off the beaten path" elements of amp building and has a large history of design, fixing exposure to amplifiers. He grew up with them.

I write and I realize that there is a variability in components and everything you do building an amp. Everyone will be a little bit different. Then it up to you to make it what you want. Ken has supposedly said when building a wreck "let's see who she wants to be". This summarizes the approach rather well.

Anyways, enough rambling. I know I appreciated the pictures even though I have mixed feelings about them. I just wanted to make a different statement about my experience with him because of the apparent respect for Ken. Don't forget the connection with the craft and the elements of cooking in your life. In the end you want to be able to approach your creations and tweaks from the heart and mind and not from the canned recipe. I think this is the basic message. Pass the pepper!

Hope this helps some,
Ross
ODwan
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Re: New Komet

Post by ODwan »

Would Ken just give you gut shots of his amplifer? I don't think so. He would help you all day long...but in a "turn it back on you with a heavy dash of help and insight"... manner. He seems like he is promoting the experience of amp building, with heavy on the personal experimentation, and not passing you out a quick and ready answer. Maybe some people don't like that, but that is how he seemed. Nice and helpful, just not the final answer.
I think Ken Fischer would be a very good teacher. A good teacher turns his pupil on to things and gives him a shove in the right direction.
Like Konfuzius once said:
Tell me and I will forget
Show me and I will remember
Let me do it and I will understand


I would never just mindlessly copy Francesca from the pics but see how KF has done some things and then go and see how they work and from there venture on with new ideas.
For me this pics are an inspiration!
Another thing about the teacher-pupil relation is the accumulation of knowledge. A pupil learns the basics from his teacher and then gains new knowledge by experimenting. Eventually the pupil becomes the teacher and thus the knowledge grows. I'm afraid that if one day Ken Fischer passes away he may take with him a huge amount of tube amp building wisdom. What we do on this forum is to gather this knowledge to be not forgotten. So I think it's a good thing!

Timo
Dai H.
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Re: New Komet

Post by Dai H. »

I suppose "outing" KF's work is definitely a grey area but it sounds like for the average person, the only way they are going to get close to a real TW is to build one or buy a commercial copy from which KF gets nothing(?), since they are so expensive and Ken is not in the best of health (and not getting any younger too I suppose), so in that regard it seems like a reasonable course for someone who wants one to clone (well... or at least try to if the magic voodoo stories are to be believed). And I wonder if the perspective of someone who does have a real one would be different if they didn't have one. Would they be singing a different tune?
RossH
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Re: New Komet

Post by RossH »

Dai H. wrote:And I wonder if the perspective of someone who does have a real one would be different if they didn't have one. Would they be singing a different tune?
For some reason this reminds me of another story he told me (which doesn't have much relation to this).

Ken said that a few years back there was a coincidental event that brought 7 or 8 trainwreck owners to Jersey..with their amplifiers. He invited them all over to do a little "tone party" of sorts. As an experiment he asked them to cover all of the amplifiers up and have everyone play every wreck extensively with their own guitar. What was the result of this do you suppose? He claims that everyone picked a different one and that NONE of the amps each owner picked was their original amplifier!

Ken's easy solution to this was to suggest to the owners that they take out the tools and swap everyone's favorite chassis with their original head box. NOONE was willing to do this!

What does that tell you about the psychology of ownership of these things? :)

Ross
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HeeBGB
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Re: New Komet

Post by HeeBGB »

Actually he told me the same story but a bit differently.

He had a "clinic" at his place with 6 Express owners. The one that he picked as "best" wasn't picked by anyone else. Nobody picked their own amp. Two guys picked each others amp and he suggested they trade but they refused.

Anyway that's what my letter says!

Everyone ALWAYS says it's in Ken's ears. If that's the case (and I believe it BTW) why all the smoke and mirrors about his amps. It's not like he cured Cancer or something. This IS a design that he has abandoned. Hell if he wants to build a few amps I don't live far from him. I'll go build one amp a week for him for free just to learn from him. Do you think he'd take me up on it? :D
toddyjoe
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Re: New Komet

Post by toddyjoe »

After giving this matter some more thought, I want to apologize if any of my prior posts in this thread were unfairly critical of any member here, including Rheingold or rocket. I think this thread has made three things abundantly clear:

(1) Every member here has a great deal of appreciation, admiration and respect for Ken Fischer and his talents;

(2) One group of us believes that the best way to show our admiration is to protect Fischer and his designs, keeping hidden the "mystery and magic" of his talents from the competitors/pirates who would steal and plunder from him; and

(3) Another group of us believes the best way to show our admiration is to spread the gospel about his designs and his innovations, displaying the magic of his art and work for all to see and learn from and hoping that his contributions to amplifier technology will carry on and not become lost when he is gone.

Rheingold, rocket and maybe others appear to be in the first group. Others, including myself, appear to be in the second group. I venture to say neither group is right or wrong or more or less sincere in their admiration of Ken Fischer and his work. Does a person who has played and poured blood and sweat onto a beaten '57 Strat over thousands of gigs for nearly forty years love the Strat any less than a man who has treasured his immaculate, untouched '57 Strat by locking it in an airtight, glass display case for forty years? Probably not. We all have different ways of showing our appreciation, and I think this thread has amply illustrated those differences.

Maybe we should go back to talking about Franchesca. :)
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HeeBGB
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Re: New Komet

Post by HeeBGB »

I have a question for group 1.

This is a quote from Hogy of Komet amps I found over at the BlueGuitar site. It is a repost of I think a thread over at Ampage.

" Sorry John, but that rumor is not based on truth.For what it's worth, Ken considers the Rocket, Liverpool, and Express to be "obsolete designs". Those amps were designed around tubes and speakers which, for practical purposes, are no longer available."

Assuming this is true why would Ken want to protect a design he feels is obsolete?

EDIT:for those who want to read it in context...here is the link

http://www.blueguitar.org/new/schem/tra ... okxpr4.pdf
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Funkalicousgroove
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Re: New Komet

Post by Funkalicousgroove »

I'd Like to just call Ken and ask him, My email address is: Funkalicousgroove_AT_Hotmail.com, If anyone has a good # for him I'd be honored to settle this whole thing, but, What if he does care?? what if he wants the pictures removed? I think we should respect his wishes if he wants them gone, I don't think anyone is here to cause him grief or aggrivation.
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HeeBGB
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Re: New Komet

Post by HeeBGB »

I will go along with that! If Ken wants them removed then so be it. Maybe we should take them down until we know for sure?



Email Sent Funk!
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Allynmey
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Re: New Komet

Post by Allynmey »

I appreciate the above comments laid out in a reflective and positive way. The firestorm that I was involved with Rocket is regrettable. The issue on this thread is not really about KF. The posts (by me) we aimed at individuals who believe they are KF's lawyers and mouthpieces that were bashing members of this forum about what it is we do here...gather info, build amps, work out bugs, and sometimes gather to show each other our work. This is an amp forum! We do what we do here because we all have a love for the sound of a Trainwreck. KF is a master builder and we all here have a respect for his knowledge and work. I'm sure most if all members here that are actually building amps are members of many amp forums. We join groups like this to gain knowledge and maybe make some friends. I am not making my TW for sale and I don't believe many members here would. If someone wanted to steal info and profit from it, they could do it elsewhere without problem.

I would like to ask a question. Has anyone here that has seen the Francesca build feel they have seen something that their mortal eyes should never lay their eyes upon? I haven't. Does KF give lessons that you or I would have paid to get but now don't have to? I would have to say no.


In closing I would like to say that this is the TrainWreck forum and not the Ken Fischer forum. We build amps, discuss mods and differences, and enjoy each others input and knowledge. Maybe the two members that feel differently should start the KF forum. I hope I don't come across as harsh but, that is how I feel.

Allynmey
Jackie Treehorn
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Re: New Komet

Post by Jackie Treehorn »

I agree. We're here to learn and share information about building tube guitar amplifiers. Not to sound insensitive, but the only criteria for the information contained should be whether it helps advance those goals.

The wrecks are not made anymore and probably never will be. The speculation is that there are only around 50 in existance, a good portion owned by a few individals. The old trainwreck site is gone and this place is the only site I can think of for accurate and comprehensive information about these amps. I strongly feel that there's a lot of value in all of the information that everyone has contributed. The accuracy and comprehensiveness of this information should not be compromised because it makes a few parties uncomfortable. In the short run, some of those "invested" parties will be angry. In the long run, anyway you look at, the information here is preserving Ken's legacy and making it possible for people to experiment with the pinnacle of guitar amp designs.

Nobody is advocating using the Francesca pictures for commercial gain, however nothing really prevents it. That's the nature of knowledge I suppose, and it's impossible to read the minds of amp builders to determine the origin of every idea. The fact of the matter is that the pictures have been posted. People have seen them and downloaded them. You can't unring the bell. Taking them down now is most likely too little too late.

Dumbles and Trainwrecks seem to always evoke a lot of adversarial reactions from owners, commercial cloners, DIY guys, etc. Ken is aware of this site and has stated he doesn't mind making wrecks for personal use. It is too bad he doesn't take it a step further and sell us transformers, kits, books, etc. There are definitely ways that Ken could make some customers without having to sell entire amps.
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snide
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Re: New Komet

Post by snide »

Good point Jackie. If KF offered any parts, books etc. I would definitely get in line to be a buyer. My take on the whole picture thing is that some individuals like to perpetuate riddles and mystery when it comes to trainwrecks. I have seen some posts here and elsewhere that were downright laughable such as the color of wire insulation selected would change the sound :lol:. The clear pictures provided so generously by HeeBee and Allynmey removed alot of the smoke and mirrors that the individuals I'm talking about relied on to further their high priest status in the wacky trainwreck cult. At the end of the day, it's just an amp for God sakes. All of the circuits have been done before. The only magic involved here is KF's ability to tweak the amp for the desired result.

Eric
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Funkalicousgroove
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Re: New Komet

Post by Funkalicousgroove »

HeeBGB,

I didn't get your mail, Funkalicousgroove_AT_hotmail.com You have to delete the underscores, I guess I should have said that.
Owner/Solder Jockey Bludotone Amp Works
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HeeBGB
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Re: New Komet

Post by HeeBGB »

I just checked. I did send it to you without the underscores. As a matter of fact i cut and pasted it and then removed the underscores and AT and put @ in their place.

I'll try again

Edit: Has been resent Funk. Did you get it? If not....send me an email and I can reply to it.
mojo
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Re: New Komet

Post by mojo »

Not really a pertinent point, but this post has been tough for me to watch. I had something similar happen on my fourth post to the Les Paul forum - I asked a question (at the time I had only a Japanese ARIA copy) about how much progress I could make towards the lofty reaches of Les Pauldom by modding my guitar. This was taken by a few as trolling, which led to a raucous interaction between several others, then to an insult hurled at a moderator by one of the combatants, then the moderator summarily kicked us all off the forum. I still lurk there since its all I can do. I tried for a year to have one of the administrators answer an email from me, no luck. I really miss the ability to search the posts, as I'm now a confirmed LP junkie with modded Historic, etc. I'm happy to see there appears to have been a much more restrained and adult reaction to controversy on this forum. Thanks.
Let that boy boogie woogie.
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