My first Trainwreck clone

[UR12]

Hey guys!

This is my first post so please be gentle.....I have been repairing and building amps for years. I took about 15 years off from the hobby and am just getting back into it. I built an Express using the layouts from the pictures that HeeBGB and Allynmey posted to the A1 schematic's specs in an old donor amp using a lot of used parts. I just got the correct Powersupply caps in and got them installed after the picture was taken. I still need to wire up my impedance switch. Here is a shot of the amp. The amp sounds great. I hope to take it to my son's band practice this after noon to see how it sounds with a live band.

I know this is a subjective question but since it would appear that Ken took a lot of things into account when designing this beast I wonder what he had in mind as far as speakers. I have heard the amp through a 4 x 12 configuration and the guy using it today will be playing through a Sovetek 4 x 12 cab. Since the amp is a little trebley I thought about finding a speaker with a lower RS (maybe 55hz or so) to add a little bottom end. Any suggestions?

Thanks!

[HeeBGB]

Nice work Dana. Welcome to the Wreck Forum.

From what I remember on the old Trainwreck.com site. Ken usually preferred Express amps with Marshall Greenback loaded 4x12 cabs with a LP jr. or special. The site used to have a data sheet on "known" Wrecks and most of the Express amps listed either Mullard or Siemans EL34's with the Marshall cab and LP Jr. or Special as Ken's favored setup. It's been a long time since I've seen it and my memory is not so good these days so take this info with a grain of salt

How does your clone sound? I heard it's pretty good. Any chance of getting Richie to post a sound clip?

Greg

[UR12]

I am going to try and see if my son can't record some of it today at their practice. If this doesn't work I will take it to Richie's and leave it with him so I can try and get him to do a clip or two when he gets time.

I am running a Used Mullard 12ax7( made in GB) in V1 (My last one I might add), a NOS Fender 7025 for V2 and a Yugoslavian (RCA) for the PI. The EL34s are Sovtek EL34Gs that I had laying around. They are new but were made back in the late 80s. Since I took 15 years off it seems that anything I have laying around that was new are now NOS.

I think I am going to change the bright switch to one that allows me to switch both caps out of the circuit. (on off on variety)

The amp has the nice EL34 midrange honk sound (I love EL34s) and a lot of treble. It really cuts through. It is not piercing but more of a natural creamy tone. Richie refers to this as a "woody tone" Describing the way an amp sounds to someone is like trying to describe the color red to a blind man.

Here's a couple more pics

[Funkalicousgroove]

Where did you get that perf board?? Do you have any more?

[UR12]

Where did you get that perf board?? Do you have any more?

I salvaged it from the donor amp and cleaned it up and cut it to size. I have enough left over to make one more PS board but that's about it.

[snide]

Dana,
First, welcome to the forum! Your build looks really good, a very genuine looking clone. I hang out over at 18watt alot and have built that amp recently. It's a nice little amp but then again it's nothing like a wreck . The wreck was designed to be mostly a lead amp so it does have a more treble sound to it. You can subdue it somewhat by going with greebacks and the right cabinet. I put the komet hi cut control on mine and it works great because all that hi end wears on my ears over the long haul. I will say that the 18watt marshall is just as touch sensitive or more than the wreck which suprised me.

Eric

[UR12]

Dana,
First, welcome to the forum! Your build looks really good, a very genuine looking clone.

Eric

Thanks for the kind words. This amp is really a 'testbed' if you will. I hope to build my next one with the right new chassis, Trannys and such and make it a lot nicer looking.

You can subdue it somewhat by going with greebacks and the right cabinet. I put the komet hi cut control on mine and it works great because all that hi end wears on my ears over the long haul. I will say that the 18watt marshall is just as touch sensitive or more than the wreck which suprised me.

Eric

That's interesting. My brother (Richie/Plexi), seemd to like the touch sensitivity of the of the Wreck a lot. I'll have to ask him his opinion of which he thinks has more .

Looks like I will be spending the month of December building a 4 x 10 cab and a 4 x 12 slant top cab. I'll have to trade in my soldering Iron for a router for a while. I'll have to procure me a set of Greenbacks. HMMMM I wonder if Richie has a set.............

Is there a schematic here somewhere for the hi cut control ?

[doctord02]

Nice work Dana! Welcome to the board. I recognise you from the 18watt board, but never made the Richie connection. I mostly just lurk over there, but I live over here and at AX84.com.

Definitely see if you can get some clips. Richie did some clips a while back with his wreckified 18 watt that were pretty smoking.

Dave

[Moose]

the 18watt marshall is just as touch sensitive or more than the wreck which suprised me.

I'll almost go so far as to say something is wrong with your express. My 18watt was nowhere NEAR as touch sensetive as my 'wreck. In fact, I ended up doing extensive modifications to it because it paled when compared to the wreck. Even after the modifications, which make the PI quite close to a liverpool, it isn't as sensetive as my wreck.

As for speakers, I like greenbacks in a 4x12 with this circuit, I've tried other genres (specifically Black Widows in a 4x12 peavy cab, and G12-35 in a 4x12) and did NOT like them, though that was just a matter of taste and not a matter of them being particularly bad. I dig the G12H in a 2x12 with mine, and have been almost as happy with the combination of a greenback and a G12H in a 2x12 cab.

I think open back cabs prefer to have a heavy magnet and more bottom end to counter the top end character of this amp. To my ear, a closed back 4x12 with greenbacks has a lot punchier bass than open backed cabinets, and the sizzle on top is less prominent. I'm guessing that's why.

Anyway, borrow some greenbacks from Ritchie and try them out. Don't be afraid to try anything like that, including stuff like Weber's silver bell, bludeog, or 1230-55. In fact, if you have acceess to a G12H or 1230-55 or something like that, I suggest trying it before you try to dial out the top end. You might be pleasantly surprised with the tone and might notice the top end less with the addition of the extra bass at the speaker.

[UR12]

Hey Moose
Thanks for the advice everyone!

My 18watt was nowhere NEAR as touch sensetive as my 'wreck. In fact, I ended up doing extensive modifications to it because it paled when compared to the wreck. Even after the modifications, which make the PI quite close to a liverpool, it isn't as sensetive as my wreck.

Since I don't play guitar I can't personally comment on the sensitivity or the attack. Having said that, the one big difference I see regarding the two preamp sections is that Ken runs a lot higher voltage on the preamp tubes than the 18watt. I would think that this in itself would make the Wreck more sensitive. They really are two great but different amps.

As for speakers, I like greenbacks in a 4x12 with this circuit, I've tried other genres (specifically Black Widows in a 4x12 peavy cab, and G12-35 in a 4x12) and did NOT like them, though that was just a matter of taste and not a matter of them being particularly bad. I dig the G12H in a 2x12 with mine, and have been almost as happy with the combination of a greenback and a G12H in a 2x12 cab.

I'll have to order a set of Celestions for the 4 x 12 and give them a try. I haven't talked to Richie yet, he may have a cab loaded with greenbacks that we can try before I buy. I'm planning on finishing a couple of speaker cabs and then want to build another Express using better parts so I'll probably be getting in touch with you to get a set of Tranny's

Thanks again for everbody's help!!

[Moose]

Well, when you're done, post a review of that 4x10. I haven't tried an express style amp with 10" speakers.

I'm always interested in how people respond to different speakers and I have a soft spot for 4x10 cabs, though I no longer own one and almost always end up with 12" speakers for my amps. :/

[UR12]

Actually the 4 X 10 cab is for a 18watt head that I built. It has a modified 5f4 Fender Super front end with a Marshall norm channel and power section. I'll definately give it a try on the Wreck though.

[Omar]

Dana,
First off, welcome to the board. Nice build. Looks like you are the first to put the Francesca pics to good use. Please post clips when you get a chance.

Omar