Ceriatone C-Wreck vs Rocket

2tone · Post by **2tone** » Sat Sep 28, 2019 5:05 pm

yes the 25 uf does increase the gain. With the 220k to ground it must lessen the gain enough to give a slight increase in volume or drive when both are employed. The cap has the effect on the bass too. Without it, more piano like low strings.

telekasper · Post by **telekasper** » Sun Sep 29, 2019 9:48 am

Ok, thanks for that. Sorry for another 'newb' question, but just to be certain, are you referring to the 22uf V1 cap, or the 22uf v2 phase inverter cap? [PI right?]

M Fowler · Post by **M Fowler** » Sun Sep 29, 2019 3:23 pm

telekasper wrote: ↑Sun Sep 29, 2019 9:48 am Ok, thanks for that. Sorry for another 'newb' question, but just to be certain, are you referring to the 22uf V1 cap, or the 22uf v2 phase inverter cap? [PI right?]

V2 pin8 22uf bypass cap

V3 is the PI tube

telekasper · Post by **telekasper** » Sun Sep 29, 2019 7:28 pm

Ok, pulled the 22uf and 220k to ground. Happy to report that it noticeably increased my clean headroom and tightened up the bass. Very happy with the results!

Thanks everybody for the suggestions!

norburybrook · Post by **norburybrook** » Mon Sep 30, 2019 9:43 am

telekasper wrote: ↑Sun Sep 29, 2019 7:28 pm Ok, pulled the 22uf and 220k to ground. Happy to report that it noticeably increased my clean headroom and tightened up the bass. Very happy with the results!
Thanks everybody for the suggestions!

did you use the Z-Wrek filtering or the higher Rocket? that may have some effect on the tightness of the bottom end . I'm going to change mine to rocket specs today so will post back.

M

telekasper · Post by **telekasper** » Mon Sep 30, 2019 11:27 am

Not sure, as my c-wreck has 5 filter caps [2-10uf/3-47uf] instead of 2+2, so the builder may have already upped the filtering. Its different than the z-wreck or rocket in that regard.
Photos prior to the cap/resistor removal.

norburybrook · Post by **norburybrook** » Mon Sep 30, 2019 4:51 pm

well i swapped out the 3x 8uF filter caps for Rocket spec 20 uF's and added one of the 8 Uf caps in parallel with a 40uF on the main power caps which is still a bit under the 80uF going to the rectifier, i need to see if i can find another 40 somewhere perhaps.

Well, all installed and honestly i can't tell any big difference really. might be a bit tighter in the bottom end...

hasn't made it sound worse though

i think the Rocket is slightly more chime-ier than the wreck, so the rocket/wreck switch is actually very useful.

M

telekasper · Post by **telekasper** » Mon Sep 30, 2019 7:04 pm

Well, it was still a little too grainy too early, so I put the 220k to ground back in and left the cap out. Thats much better in the clean department, but it really lost alot of volume. Might be loud enough still for this fall/winters club gigs though so I'll leave it this way.
Any other suggestions for making this a clean amp and I'm all ears!

M Fowler · Post by **M Fowler** » Mon Sep 30, 2019 10:24 pm

The 220k plate resistor is what causes the early breakup so what I do for country players is reduce that to 120K.

The Zwreck has a completely different dropping string/filter cap arrangement you may want to reduce the dropping string resistors and bring the v1 voltage up slightly for more clean.

I get by using the 290-0-290 transformers because I use Russian tubes 6n14n.

Mark

telekasper · Post by **telekasper** » Tue Oct 01, 2019 7:38 am

Thanks Mark, are you referring to the 27k/22k 3w resistors? What value would you recommend?

M Fowler · Post by **M Fowler** » Tue Oct 01, 2019 3:01 pm

Yes B+4 is 22k I would go down to 10K and measure voltage for V1 pin 1 want to get around 190-195vdc

C wreck tube chart.xlsx

telekasper · Post by **telekasper** » Wed Oct 02, 2019 9:01 am

Pin 1 is empty. Pin 6 measures 159v

M Fowler · Post by **M Fowler** » Wed Oct 02, 2019 1:03 pm

Yeah pin 6 for your amp. 159v is low try increase that by reducing the B+4 dropping resistor.

telekasper · Post by **telekasper** » Wed Oct 02, 2019 3:52 pm

Thanks, Hope I'm following. I changed the 22k/3w at the filter caps [b4] to 10k and there was no voltage increase, so I put the 22k back.
There is a 22k/3w on the circuit board [also B4] that ties to v1. I changed that to 10k and the voltage went up to 170v but it seems a little bassier. If anything, I would like to cut some bass content.
On the layout, which 22k / 3w are you referring to?
Another question, the 10k thats on the bass pot to ground sets the midrange, right? Can this value be lowered for less mids?
The amp sounds great and there is enough clean headroom now. I'd just like to fine tune a couple things and get as much headroom as possible.

Mark · Post by **Mark** » Thu Oct 03, 2019 11:20 am

I'm wondering what your expectations of more headroom is?

The amp will only put out 25 to 30 watts. There comes a time where more headroom means more watts.

Perhaps you mean transient response and are looking for better attack?

Maybe you need to run a compressor/limitor before the amp to increase the clean volume?

I'm not sure what you mean.

The Amp Garage

Ceriatone C-Wreck vs Rocket

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