TW "Manning" Express Build

[ChloeFree]

clips, clips, clips, please

[jazzbass]

Hi Pfarrell,

I adopt this line in building projects that have marked the history of music, first I try to build it equal to the original project, this after reading the documents I find on the web, then I allow myself a more or less long time to "understand its sound "and if that fits my expectations. Obviously I search the web for as many clips as I can find of someone (good). Lastly, I make those changes that I think are necessary for the use I want to make of it.
I assure you that the Trainwreck Express was the hardest of all the amps I built, I did the same route as you so much that the chassis has holes all over it. After each modification I would revert to the original design and / or one of the documented variants, and this is how I discovered how to "tame a wild horse". I assure you that this amp has no competitors and is a world unto itself that must be experienced. A piece of advice, pay great attention to the position of each wire especially in the preamplifier area, it is there that the background noise is born and even the smallest displacement is of enormous importance for the, even total, reduction and again, any variation. from the initial project it is another amplifier.

P.S. this is the photo of the Trainwreck Liverpool, the last amp of the line I built. I don't have any photos of the Express because initially I didn't like it and when it finally satisfied me I didn't take any more photos.


A hug, Franco

[pfarrell]

I like hugs! Thanks Franco.

I respect everything you are stating. All makes sense—I like your approach. I tend to go a bit more rogue. I do care about being faithful to the original intent, to a degree, but also am not afraid of modifying out of the gate, if it seems reasonable—or I will add the mods later, one at at time with time between to attempt some understanding. Depends. I like to go back and forth to understand what the change IS, going back is often where I find the "reveal". On my AB763—VibroVerb—It seems universally agreed that nobody uses the first channel—so I changed it without trying it first. I love the first channel! Also added trem and reverb to it. Anyway—I will definitely build another Trainwreck—and will copy the official layout plan for the next one—I have a ton of Sprague caps that literally don't fit anywhere—I love that I have Martin's version as a future comparison too. Maybe my slightly cavalier attitude is because I built a ton of HiFi equipment from scratch (at least 14 amps, and speakers)—massively assisted by all the fine people over at DIYaudio.com and Nelson Pass. We listen daily—vinyl centric—but also connected to the movie setup etc. I learned a ton doing all that—and continue to do so...you can find me there under the same handle if you wanna look up some of that stuff—same for the TDPRI forum...

Now that the MM-TW-Express is working... I'll chop stick it with everything dimed to see what's what with lead dress. Part of what is super cool, IMO, about Martin's build is that every lead is super short! Smart, IMO.

(Oh, Martin, I wanted to ask you if you have any starting points you like for settings???? That would be cool to know. Also... the pwr tube diode array that's on the KF versions? Pretty sure I understand the why in theory...but you forwent that, I was curious.)

Franco, GORGEOUS amp BTW. The Liverpool.

[jazzbass]

Hi Pfarrell,

luckily for me or unfortunately for me, each person has a different sensitivity to sounds and a very personal yardstick, so first of all, I build the amp following the original plan because I want to hear with my ears how it sounds (do you know St. Thomas?) .

Recordings on the web are also not 100% reliable. Only after having built it I modify the project ..... if I feel like it, if I have time, if I don't have other projects that intrigue me .

A hug, Franco

[pfarrell]

Okay... Loving this amp... still trying to figure it out... but it's special. And a beast. Clips soon I promise..

Rocket or Liverpool next? Or?

[Colossal]

Rocket or Liverpool next?

The correct answer is yes

[martin manning]

I will definitely build another Trainwreck—and will copy the official layout plan for the next one—I have a ton of Sprague caps that literally don't fit anywhere—I love that I have Martin's version as a future comparison too.

It would be interesting to have that direct comparison using the same parts in the original layout, but I'm betting there wouldn't be any significant difference when the MV, Cut, and stage three entrance trimmer are set to match the original circuit (as closely as possible in the case of the cut control). I'd guess that component tolerances will have the largest effect.

Now that the MM-TW-Express is working... I'll chop stick it with everything dimed to see what's what with lead dress. Part of what is super cool, IMO, about Martin's build is that every lead is super short! Smart, IMO.

Yea, that was the appeal of that style of layout for me too. If you don't find anything happening when you push the leads around (and they won't move far, of course!) then I would call that a successful and robust layout. I do believe that component positioning and lead dress make a difference, since everything has some electrical communication with everything else, but the essence of the sound of a given circuit (meaning at audio frequencies) is in the component values. The one or two pF between closely spaced leads might be enough to cause or suppress an oscillation, but due to the small capacitances involved it's mainly going to be affecting ultrasonic frequencies. The Express circuit is designed to be on the edge of stability, with little attenuation between stages and small or non-existent grid stoppers. Accordingly, noise is an issue, and the first thing to do is find a quiet, non-microphonic tube for V1.

(Oh, Martin, I wanted to ask you if you have any starting points you like for settings???? That would be cool to know. Also... the pwr tube diode array that's on the KF versions? Pretty sure I understand the why in theory...but you forwent that, I was curious.)

As you've no doubt discovered, it's loud! If you turn the MV down, generally less presence is needed (due to the reduced relative FB), and I've found that the cut control is useful for restoring some of what is lost in the tone. The tone stack does not have as much mid scoop as a BF Fender, so you might prefer turning up the bass, depending on what you have plugged in.

I left the snubber diodes out because sometimes they can have a partial failure that alters the sound, and isn't obvious.

[pfarrell]

Thanks for all the explanations Martin. Here's a quick shot of the case as it came together. I was planning Tolex—but didn't do it at the last minute—the wood wasn't the best since I thought I was covering it... but in the end, it's the classiest amp in the collection i think...little rough here and there... but none of that will matter in 20 years.

PF-TWExpress-Manning_15.jpg

[Colossal]

Very, very nice! I like the clean aesthetics.

[martin manning]

Very nice indeed! It says formalwear to me ;^)

[pfarrell]

Ha! Thanks! It was a concern (formalwear ... but I just let it evolve with the "on hand" materials—plus I'm not the only visual person in the house (and she has to live with the wall of amps too).... VERY satisfying to have this amp!

Rocket next I think... Don't have anything in the stable that's EL84... (Still waiting on Dumble iron.... sheesh...)

[ChopSauce]

Congrats!

I'm not the only visual person in the house ...

I know that ...

[pfarrell]

I spent some time this am playing the Express back to back with my AB763 Vibroverb. What an amp (the Express). I REALLY like it. It speaks to me for some reason—makes me want to be a good guitarist—it's got some sort of sparkle thing happening that I haven't achieved on the Verb...All subjective I'm sure. Less is more? I DO like reverb though... so... maybe in the future a TW w/ reverb? Makes me pretty jacked to try the Rocket.

I'm going to modify my Vibroverb and put in the Type-2 MV (also needs some trem de-noising). Whats in the Verb is Type-3 and i think it's not that usable and it's frankly a noise maker—and I've already tinkered with it. The Express setup is perfect IMO—it's also got a much lower noise floor than the Verb—much more going on it that amp though.... I have a dual gang linear pot on hand, will be interesting to see how that works against the audio taper in the Express. Robrob over at robrobinette.com specs a linear pot... we'll see.

It should be noted that the Verb is plugged into a 15" Weber... and the Express a 12" Creamback. I will certainly be making a 2x12 with G12-65s (for Dumble use too.)

[Colossal]

so... maybe in the future a TW w/ reverb? Makes me pretty jacked to try the Rocket.

Check out all of the work here by RJguitars, Mark Fowler, Joeboo, and many others on the big bottle Rockets with and without added reverb. The Rocket is a great pedal platform too.

[dorrisant]

so... maybe in the future a TW w/ reverb? Makes me pretty jacked to try the Rocket.

Check out all of the work here by RJguitars, Mark Fowler, Joeboo, and many others on the big bottle Rockets with and without added reverb. The Rocket is a great pedal platform too.

Absolutely!!

Big bottle Rocket = Rockster
https://ampgarage.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=7300

PCB based Express was originally posted by rj
https://ampgarage.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=17524

I learned from Mark Fowler that posting links is an incredible help.