Classic-Tone Transformers fo AC30

Vox and Hiwatt Discussion

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Mark
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Re: Classic-Tone Transformers fo AC30

Post by Mark »

I hear what you are saying Mark, but it is still nice to turn on that amp and say that amp is just something else.

I've encountered Vox reissue AC-30's and I was astounded by their mediocrity. I think this the sort of thing Jay was talking about.
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jaysg
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Re: Classic-Tone Transformers fo AC30

Post by jaysg »

M Fowler wrote:How many ordinary guitar players actually need MM, Woden or Haddon transformers?
We had an A/B test with a couple AC30CC1 amps I've worked on. Both set up with a Celestion Gold. One had nearly full Caldwell mods and the other was stock. Essentially, the mods and MM Woden OT compact, rearrange and reduce the high end frequency response, making it sit better in a band/mix situation. While still a Vox, the stock CC amp sounded more like a silverface Fender. hth
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Re: Classic-Tone Transformers fo AC30

Post by TUBEDUDE »

I'd love my quad EL84 amp to sound like Rory Gallagher's amp. When he played Cross Me Off Your List in Austin circa '75, it sounded like it was going to explode! I think it was the best AC30 tone ever. But if that means a $300 Red output tranny, I'll use something else. After using MM outputs in a tone quest with Deluxe reverbs, I found them no better but much more expensive than the four other contenders. Too high a greed factor for me to support. YMMV.
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Mark
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Re: Classic-Tone Transformers fo AC30

Post by Mark »

Hi Tubedude

what conclusions did you come to from your Deluxe experimentation?

Who did you think made the best transformer set?

Getting back on topic, I've heard rather lame AC-30's and I've heard AC-30's that really gave it up. It would be interesting to why this is so. Have you tried a treble booster prior to either the normal or Top Boost channels?

I thought R.G. used one.
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Re: Classic-Tone Transformers fo AC30

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:evil:
Signatures have a 255 character limit that I could abuse, but I am not Cecil B. DeMille.
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jaysg
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Re: Classic-Tone Transformers fo AC30

Post by jaysg »

TUBEDUDE wrote:But if that means a $300 Red output tranny, I'll use something else. After using MM outputs in a tone quest with Deluxe reverbs, I found them no better but much more expensive than the four other contenders. Too high a greed factor for me to support. YMMV.
Red? Just wondering...the MM Woden I installed wasn't red, it was black.

In MM's defense, I don't think their business model is to cater to one-off buyers or infrequent buyers. Heyboer will do that, but MM essentially does musical equipment work for the fun of being in it. Their focus is on commercial and MIL spec transformers...same as Pacific, I believe. That high entry cost for your first purchase is meant to dissuade you.

As to the other question floating, MM gets touted in magazines and on line, but they're not the only guys capable of doing tear downs and documenting well enough to make more. I think being in LA helps for their LA customers like Rivera, 65Amps, etc.

[edit] to TubeDude post below...I don't get any magazines anymore. I didn't know they advertised. hmm....
Last edited by jaysg on Sat Jul 18, 2015 8:28 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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TUBEDUDE
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Re: Classic-Tone Transformers fo AC30

Post by TUBEDUDE »

To be fair, my amp is not an exact AC30 clone. The pair of 1940's RCA 6V6's is cathode biased at a Vp of 310V, Rk @ 400 Ohms, so the impedance is not exact. I tried the MM toneclone FBFPO, a Schumacher 125A6A, Weber WO40408, Schumacher NSC022848, a Hammond 125 and a handmade C core output. The group has a variety of type, and sized cores, as well as different impedances. I took the outputs into well broken in 8 Ohm, or 4 Ohm Weber Blue Dog speakers. I found the Schumacher NSC022848 to be the tone king of the group. Perhaps not the perfect conditions for a strict comparison, but a good way to find the best of what I had available.
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TUBEDUDE
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Re: Classic-Tone Transformers fo AC30

Post by TUBEDUDE »

jaysg wrote:
TUBEDUDE wrote:But if that means a $300 Red output tranny, I'll use something else. After using MM outputs in a tone quest with Deluxe reverbs, I found them no better but much more expensive than the four other contenders. Too high a greed factor for me to support. YMMV.
Red? Just wondering...the MM Woden I installed wasn't red, it was black.

In MM's defense, I don't think their business model is to cater to one-off buyers or infrequent buyers. Heyboer will do that, but MM essentially does musical equipment work for the fun of being in it. Their focus is on commercial and MIL spec transformers...same as Pacific, I believe. That high entry cost for your first purchase is meant to dissuade you.



As to the other question floating, MM gets touted in magazines and on line, but they're not the only guys capable of doing tear downs and documenting well enough to make more. I think being in LA helps for their LA customers like Rivera, 65Amps, etc.

Their magazine advertising seems aimed at amp owners over manufacturers. I bought the 4 MM xfmrs I have from retailers that buy in bulk. Their costs were reflected in the pricing.
I hate to do it, but I think for peace of mind, I have to pull an A470 out of my Dyna Stereo 70 just to see how it does with a quad of el84's.
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TUBEDUDE
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Re: Classic-Tone Transformers fo AC30

Post by TUBEDUDE »

Mark,
I forgot to mention, the is no top boost in my preamp. It has a 2 stage warm channel with a simple tone control to save gain. It stays clean at lower settings only. It's split out and feeds a 3 stage hot channel that has a small signal pentode and simple tone also. The output has no global feedback. I removed the reverb last year and will use the tube for a buffered effects loop. So all in all, not really a Deluxe.
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Re: Classic-Tone Transformers fo AC30

Post by Stevem »

Clyde, where all of the transformers in your test out interleaved ?
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Re: Classic-Tone Transformers fo AC30

Post by norburybrook »

my 2 cents......

I'm just coming to the end of a tour of Australia and have been using rental AC30 TB's every night.

I've had old, new, and everything in between. Only consistent thing was they all had Blue speakers!

they all had a distinct AC30 sound. Some where louder than others, one in particular sounded amazing one night and then not so great in the next venue. I had no idea which were really old ones or slightly old or new even, but I will say there wasn't a great deal between them all in reality, even the one I new was a new version as it had a master volume.

So my point really is; when gigging every night the difference in transformers really wont make that much difference compared to the other variables one has to deal with in a different venue every night.



Marcus


p.s. I've grown to quite enjoy the AC30....it was only an accident I started to use one on the 2nd night as the twin I had was faulty.
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