New 100W Hiwatt build questions

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andresound
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New 100W Hiwatt build questions

Post by andresound »

Hi Guys,
I am new to the Hiwatt forum section and to this hobby. I have built 2 TW amps (express & rocket), and 1 Dumble ODS (2nd gen). All these amps sound great!! Now that I have had my counselling for this newfound addiction (LOL), I am tempted to try a Hiwatt DR 103/504 type build.
I have purchased an old LANEY 100w supergroup with PARTRIDGE transformers. The amp is functional, but sounds shit! Would this Transformer set work for a DR103 build?

Any suggestions/advice would be most welcome.
If it sounds good, it is good! Trust your ears
dcribbs1412
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Re: New 100W Hiwatt build questions

Post by dcribbs1412 »

Not to sound discouraging
Those amps are almost getting vintage Marshall status
If its in decent shape maybe try to get the Laney working properly first.
I hear its a very nice amp when working properly.
Just a suggestion

D
andresound
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Re: New 100W Hiwatt build questions

Post by andresound »

Thanks D. Where can I get a schematic? Also thought about using the OT for a Dumble 100w build. The PT voltages are too high!
If it sounds good, it is good! Trust your ears
dcribbs1412
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Re: New 100W Hiwatt build questions

Post by dcribbs1412 »

Hi andresound
no schem but some good info here
http://vintageamps.com/plexiboard/viewt ... 10&t=68681
I believe the Laney you have is very close if not a copy of a Marshall circuit.
JMP or Plexi.
If its in good cosmetic condition suggest taking a little time
going through the power supply and checking/replacing caps
maybe some tubes and see if you can get her to sing.
post some pics if possible some pics of a 71 here
http://www.amparchives.com/album/Laney/ ... index.html
came across these schems hope this helps

D
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rp
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Re: New 100W Hiwatt build questions

Post by rp »

dcribbs1412 wrote:Not to sound discouraging. Those amps are almost getting vintage Marshall status
+1 and there's plenty of old Marshalls around, not many LSG. I was never the biggest BS fan, even as a kid, but no denying Iommi was a great tonemeister. The amps must have had a bit to do with it :) Keep twiddling the knobs.

http://www.woodytone.com/2009/02/27/ton ... noid-gear/

picts???
andresound
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Re: New 100W Hiwatt build questions

Post by andresound »

Got amp to work properly. :D

Flip this thing is LOUD!!! Still, I find it too stiff and bland sounding. NO MOJO! Would be a great pedal platform or bass amp. Maybe I can convert this into a JCM or PLEXI (with MV) type sound.

Thanks D for the schematics
If it sounds good, it is good! Trust your ears
DenDanger
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Re: New 100W Hiwatt build questions

Post by DenDanger »

Yes. Good heavens. Don't chop up that amp. Fix it up!
Would be a good challenge.

Denny
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rp
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Re: New 100W Hiwatt build questions

Post by rp »

I think a good part of what you don't like about is the big Partridge iron - abundant current, well regulated PT and high bandwidth over spec'd OT. Bet if you Marshall it it'll sound much the same. Restore it right, get it working Iommi sweet, and sell it to a BS nut who will slobber over it, fondle it, and play it loud.
strelok
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Re: New 100W Hiwatt build questions

Post by strelok »

+1 fix it up, sell it. With the money you get for it you ought to be able to get yourself a full set of parts to build a DR103 from scratch, if not pretty close. Check out Merren transformers. He makes a clone of the DR103 OT. From what I hear people really like his Marshall transformers and I would expect the same from his Partridge clone. Its down at the bottom of this page:

http://www.merrenaudio.com/marshall_output_transformers
andresound
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Re: New 100W Hiwatt build questions

Post by andresound »

rp wrote:I think a good part of what you don't like about is the big Partridge iron - abundant current, well regulated PT and high bandwidth over spec'd OT. Bet if you Marshall it it'll sound much the same. Restore it right, get it working Iommi sweet, and sell it to a BS nut who will slobber over it, fondle it, and play it loud.
Wouldn't these iron qualities be good for a Dumble build?
If it sounds good, it is good! Trust your ears
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sliberty
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Re: New 100W Hiwatt build questions

Post by sliberty »

BTW - if a loud, clean platform is NOT what you want, don't build a HiWatt ;)
andresound
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Re: New 100W Hiwatt build questions

Post by andresound »

Ok, so the consensus is;

1. If big loud and clean is not what I want, DONT build a Hiwatt. This was my original intention, a DR103! Never heard this type of amp, so I will go with the advice given here.
2. Fix and sell the LANEY "as is", to fund a different style build. Unfortunately, transporting a build kit (with 100w type iron) from the states, is VERY expensive!!! SO this option is not viable. I got this Laney for approx $140 without tubes. As a comparison, to ship turret board, caps, resistors and pots etc, is $70 EXCLUDING cost of goods!!!

YOU GUYS ARE LUCKY!!!

SO, of the 3 builds under my belt, I am loving the ODS the most. My bass player is using a FENDER BASSMAN 100 I purchased a while ago, with the intention to use it as a donor for a 100w DUMBLE. This LANEY is definitely louder and cleaner than the FENDER. DO you guys think the FENDER iron would be better for a double build than the LANEY iron??
If it sounds good, it is good! Trust your ears
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sliberty
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Re: New 100W Hiwatt build questions

Post by sliberty »

I imagine that you should be able to source parts ad kits in the UK. But, another option is to buy a Ceriatone kit without the transformers (to lighten the shipping load) and then just get the transformers in the UK.
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rp
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Re: New 100W Hiwatt build questions

Post by rp »

Good God man, leave that Partridge iron where it is. Why do you think no one is building Dumbles with huge over spec’d wide bandwidth hifi iron? There's plenty of it around, Edcor (sort of hifi), Hammond 1600, Sowter. Dumble clones sell for over $3K, so it’s not for thrift.

I've never plugged into a Dumble or clone, but Dumbles use Fender iron and you can certainly hear it in the warm cleans, but even in the extra gain stages you can here the Fender origin. I am familiar w/ Orange, Hiwatt, Sound City, and they all share a sound and that sound is the Partridge iron. Plus with the squashed Dumble OD sound a wideband OT seems like a waste. If that Laney is working well and you don't like it and you gut it you will have a trashed Laney and very likely a Dumble you won't like either.

About the only thing you could successfully mod it into is a Hiwatt, Orange or Sound City but that is sort of chasing your tail. If you have the design skills you could maybe create something new and wonderful, but at the sake of destroying a fine vintage amp isn't right IMO. Don't know what yours looks like but in NYC, LA, London they'd be asking $2k for a solid Laney.

Trying to achieve magic through parts swapping serendipity is a pretty big waste of time. I know since I butchered scores of fine old amps before I figured out there are no better sounds in them, at least that you can find by swapping parts. Those vintage circuits sound great because of the circuit, parts, speaker, cab, combined. If you want to go beyond you have to do what Dumble, Fisher, Soldano, Smith, Bogner, Shur, etc did and design your new sounds, not swap parts. Not saying that a Partridge Dumble may not be the voice of God waiting to speak, but the odds are very much against it, and not worth destroying a classic amp to find out.
andresound
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Re: New 100W Hiwatt build questions

Post by andresound »

Point taken. I will revive the LANEY and post pics. And then make available for sale at half the going price!!! $1k. Maybe do a trade for a parts kit?? :wink:
If it sounds good, it is good! Trust your ears
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