Eminence Speaker Advice...

[GaryLC]

Hi there!

I'm going to replace my old Fisher 12" speakers with something new. They are in an old Airline Twin Twelve, maybe 40 watts. Sounds quite dark. I've narrowed it down to the Eminence Private Jack, Cannabis Rex or Texas Heat. I'm mainly an old school rock player (Beatles, Grand Funk, James Gang, Steppenwolf, etc.) Any suggestions?

[xtian]

Texas Heat. The Cannabis (or any hemp cones) will make your dark amp even darker. You may want to add a bright cap or treble peaker to your amp if it doesn't already have.

[telentubes]

I put a Texas Heat in a 50 watt Small Special and am quite surprised at how good it sounds. Better than the Swamp Thang, way better than my EV12L, and better than a G1265.
They are inexpensive so my expectations were low, but it's a great match for that particular amp. I don't know how it would pair with your amp.
Another Eminence that I really really like in Fendery circuits is the JS1250, which is the Josh Smith Signature 50watt 12". Really dig those.

[GaryLC]

Thanks, guys! One thing I forgot to mention is that I need either 4 ohm or 16 ohm speakers, a lot of the other Eminence speakers I was looking at only come in 8 ohms. The amp has an 8 ohm output, currently has two Fisher 4 ohm stock speakers wired in series. So I would either do that, or use two 16 ohm speakers in parallel.

[Leo_Gnardo]

I put a Texas Heat in a 50 watt Small Special - - - way better than my EV12L

HA! And I've been calling Texas Heat "the poor man's ElectroVoice" for years. "Better than!" And they'll leave you with plenty of change in your pocket, and less of a back ache. Good all around! BTW EV and Eminence have been sharing technology for years. Maybe the Texas Heat is the product of that cooperation. I'd like to think so. Everywhere I've installed them, people like 'em and nobody's complained.

Now... if they could get that tone with an neodymium magnet, that would be 'da bomb.'

[telentubes]

I think I paid about $60 for the Texas Heat when I bought it from Avatar Speakers.

[GaryLC]

Thanks again, guys!
I've got a couple other responses about the Texas Heat, sounds like it's a "well loved" speaker! Some folks said the "Legend 1258" is a decent inexpensive option too, but it's only available in 8 ohm. I think I'll pick myself up a couple Heats and give them a try! Avatar doesn't carry them anymore, they're running around $95 most places now.

[GaryLC]

Here's a question showing what a nooby I am when it comes to electronics & speakers in general. I can get the Texas Heat in both 4 ohm & 16 ohm (as well as 8 ohm). This may be a stupid question, but is there any advantage to having two 4 ohms in series vs. two 16 ohms in parallel? Will there be any sound difference, or since the amp will see the same load, and they are basically the same speaker, will it all be the same.

Thanks again, love learning from you folks!!!

[pompeiisneaks]

I don't know about sound, but in series, they each have to be rated for the max wattage of the amp, in parallel, in theory, they share the load mostly equally. (in practice it's not perfect) so for better capacity with the same wattage speakers two 16 in parallel is more power handling. Not sure if there's a tonal difference.

~Phil

[GaryLC]

I don't know about sound, but in series, they each have to be rated for the max wattage of the amp, in parallel, in theory, they share the load mostly equally. (in practice it's not perfect) so for better capacity with the same wattage speakers two 16 in parallel is more power handling. Not sure if there's a tonal difference.

~Phil

Thanks, Phil! In this case it wouldn't be a problem. The Texas Heat speakers are rated for 150 watts, and the amp is only a 40 watt amp. Just wondering of there would be any difference in sound depending on how they were wired.

[didit]

[...] in series, they each have to be rated for the max wattage of the amp, in parallel, in theory, they share the load mostly equally[...]

Actually, in both arrangements each speaker is taking half a load. Hence 8 Ohms working.

Now... if they could get that tone with an neodymium magnet, that would be 'da bomb.'

Take it your critique includes the Lil' Texas? I've yet to have Texas Heat around for testing A vs B, but once broken in a Lil' Texas does (for my ears) commendably well in Fender combos - both in a re-baffled Princeton & in a '70 Deluxe Reverb.

Best .. Ian

[GaryLC]

Take it your critique includes the Lil' Texas? I've yet to have Texas Heat around for testing A vs B, but once broken in a Lil' Texas does (for my ears) commendably well in Fender combos - both in a re-baffled Princeton & in a '70 Deluxe Reverb.

Best .. Ian

Thanks, Ian! I hadn't considered that one because I see that it's only offered as an 8 ohm speaker. It seems that I need either two 4 ohm or 16 ohm speakers to match the 8 ohm output of the amp.

[pompeiisneaks]

[...] in series, they each have to be rated for the max wattage of the amp, in parallel, in theory, they share the load mostly equally[...]

Actually, in both arrangements each speaker is taking half a load. Hence 8 Ohms working.


Best .. Ian

I would like an explanation of that. My understanding of resistance and impedance in series is that the first speaker takes the full load, then the second would, in theory, take the full load as well, whatever wasn't dropped by the first. Maybe I'm confusing resistance and impedance though. ?

Even so, the load absorbed is based upon them being identical and no two speakers are identical, so it's never a perfect world. This sometimes can cause a speaker to fail just because it's getting a bit too much power vs the other(s) in the cabinet.

No?

~Phil

[sluckey]

I would like an explanation of that. My understanding of resistance and impedance in series is that the first speaker takes the full load, then the second would, in theory, take the full load as well, whatever wasn't dropped by the first. Maybe I'm confusing resistance and impedance though. ?

I'd rather see an explanation or evidence of YOUR statement.

[Tony Bones]

I would like an explanation of that. My understanding of resistance and impedance in series is that the first speaker takes the full load, then the second would, in theory, take the full load as well, whatever wasn't dropped by the first. Maybe I'm confusing resistance and impedance though. ?

The short answer is conservation of energy - or conservation of power in this case, still valid. If an amp is putting 20W into two speakers, they can't both receive 20W of power. That would be 40W total. Where'd the extra 20W come from?

The long answer makes use of the equation P = V^2 / R. Figure out what the voltage across a single 8 ohm speaker must be @20W (12.65Vrms), a pair of speakers in series for 16 ohms (V=18Vrms), and a pair in parallel for 4 ohms (V=9.0Vrms).

Now, for the 16 ohm case, realize that the 18V signal is divided equally between the two speakers (9 volts each), then the power to each speaker is P = 9^2 / 8 = 10W.

For the parallel (4 ohm) case, the power delivered to each speaker is ... we already figured it out: P = 9^2 / 8 = 10W.

All of the above assumes a tube amp with 4, 8, and 16 ohm outputs that allow you to load the amp identically in each case. In the case of a SS amp with vanishing low output impedance the output voltage won't change (much.) So if you get 20W into an 8 ohm load, then you'll get close to 40W with a 4 ohm load (20W per speaker) but only 10W with a 16 ohm load (5W per speaker.)

But, I'm assuming a tube amp with 4, 8, and 16 ohm output taps where, to first order, there is no difference between series or parallel connections of the speakers provided you choose the right OT tap.

Having said that, there are some people that claim the 4 ohm tap uses only some of the secondary windings while the 16 ohm tap uses all of them, hence the 16 ohm tap works better. I've never A/B'ed, so I can't comment on that...