RF 1992

[Suckseeder]

Last night I was watching some old RF live videos and came across this concert in Rom from late ´92.
Wow, the Band is rockin and having fun,great tone,lots of gain,it sounds as if he ´s using the PAB a lot,
and he sure plays loud. Is this amp before or after the skyliner conversion? What do you think?

https://youtu.be/FN0aGvD2HCA

[Charlie Wilson]

I’m thinking Low Plate Classic.
CW

[talbany]

Suckseeder post_id=438521 time=1645711099 user_id=22712]
Last night I was watching some old RF live videos and came across this concert in Rom from late ´92.
Wow, the Band is rockin and having fun,great tone,lots of gain,it sounds as if he ´s using the PAB a lot,
and he sure plays loud. Is this amp before or after the skyliner conversion? What do you think?

Here is a rundown of the history of #0102 here..https://ampgarage.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=12873


Hi All
Attached is a Layout of ODS #102 the famous Robben Ford green light amp and what we know about it so far.. As well as notes from my own info on the amp..
here is some history of the amp as posted by Max (Thanks Max)in this thread
Amp 1:

RF got his first Dumble amp (#0102) in 1982. 4th generation "classic" ODS head, black tolex (or perhaps dark grey suede with vox grill) Later updated to skyline specs

And the original Miles Davis ("King of Priests", "Live in Montreux" etc.) and "Talk To Your Daughter" "classic" circuit of #102 (1982 - at least 1990), is already documented here http://ampgarage.com/forum/viewtopic.ph ... 327#137327.

Some "historic" details:

When RF got #102 in 1982 it will for sure not have been in the black tolex cabinet in which it was mounted in the nineties after its skyline update. This black tolex cabinet obviously has the tolex covered cross bar between the chassis and the grill cloth and this kind of "cross bar cabinet" wasn't yet in existence in 1982. The first amps mounted into such "cross bar cabinets" have been the "classic >>> skyline transition generation goldscript ODS" amps starting around series #14X.

When RF got #102 in 1982 it was one of the very first (#094 was still a transition generation "classic" ODS) 4th generation "classic" ODS amps with a circuit like the one documented in this layout http://ampgarage.com/forum/viewtopic.ph ... 327#137327.

When RF got #102 in 1982 it was mounted in a usual 4th generation "classic" ODS cabinet in which it stayed until its skyline mod. Here you can see #102 in a 1989 video at a time when it was still a "classic" amp and still in its original 4th generation "classic" cabinet: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qiz30Hzhta4.

AFAIK Robben Ford's first Dumble ODS #102 stayed a "classic" ODS and in its original Vox grill cabinet until at least June 1990 and then was updated to skyline specs and fitted into the black "cross bar" cabinet.

AFAIK here it is still a "classic", too, and obviously still in its original Vox grill cabinet: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eBMC6BHSucY (2:17) and http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yqn1AnA4CMQ (4:57 and 9:07) BTW: In this concert his 4th generation "classic" #102 is obviously already backed up by his then new backup combination - his goldscript "from classic to skyline transition generation ODS" and a matching tan 2x12" cabinet.

Here in June 1990 this "goldscript" backup amp #148 is still in its original tan cabinet. Later this backup amp (# around 14X AFAIR) was mounted into the green combo cabinet and now it is mounted in the black tolex cabinet. #102 is mounted today in the original tan cabinet of this "goldscript" backup amp.

Here’s a picture of #102 still its original Vox grill cabinet (Miles Davis tour 1986): http://www.gettyimages.com/detail/99638837

Pictures of #102 in the black "cross bar" cabinet and of the "gold script" back up amp in the green combo cabinet you find here http://www.roblivesey.com/dumble/ in the "Robben Ford" link (scroll down a bit until you've nearly reached the end of the series number list).

A picture of the "goldscript" backup amp still in its original tan cabinet you find in the 4th edition of Aspen Pittman's "The Tube Amp Book" on page 154.

Clips of the current circuit of #102 (now in the tan cabinet) are easy to find at the YouTube site.

#102 is the ODS, which sometimes has been called here the "green light, green switches" ODS.

Further Discssion here
http://ampgarage.com/forum/viewtopic.ph ... 548#132548

in the meantime I remembered and looked again at a picture that shows Robben Ford’s Dumble gear in 1987. This picture was published in the March 1988 edition of the magazine "Soundcheck" as the title-page for the Steven Rosen interview with Alexander. On this picture you see Alexander standing behind a pile of his gear:

On the bottom right you see the flight case of Robben Ford’s black 2x12” cabinet. On top of this flight case, and on the right beside the flight case of his Dumble head, stands his black 2x12” cabinet. On top of his 2x12” cabinet stands his Vox grill ODS. And on this picture you can clearly see the green EQ switches and the green pilot light of Robben’s "green light / green EQ switches" ODS chassis that currently resides in the tan cabinet.

Based on this picture and on what has been posted here up to now - this now is my theory and its practical implications:

- The "green light / green EQ switches" chassis, currently residing in the 8 holes tan head cabinet, is his first ODS that RF got in 1982. Originally a 4th generation "low plate classic" ODS and originally in the Vox grill cabinet.

- For the TTYD recording sessions RF used (at least as he tells it in the "Guitar Player" interview) this "green light / green EQ switches" chassis - still a "low plate classic" then and still in its original Vox grill cabinet - and his Dumble 2x12" cabinet with EV speakers.

- For the '88/'89 TTYD tour he used again the "green light / green EQ switches" chassis in the Vox grill cabinet.

- By no later than 1993 he then got the 8 bolts "gold script ODS", then still in its tan 8 holes cabinet and most likely accompanied by the matching tan 2x12” speaker cabinet.

- Around the same time his first "green light / green switches" chassis was updated to "high plate skyline" specs and an 8 bolts fastening system, left the Vox grill cabinet and went into a new style 8 holes black cabinet.

- After the skyline and 8 bolts update of the "green light / green EQ switches" chassis RF used it in its new style 8 holes black cabinet on his 1993 tour, at least in Europe.

- At some point before Montreux 2007 his 1982 "green light / green EQ switches" chassis was mounted into the 8 holes tan cabinet of the "gold script" chassis and the 8 bolts "gold script" chassis was mounted into the black 8 holes new style cabinet.

So the "green light / green EQ switches" chassis is his first ODS used from 1982 until now.

Result from a practical point of view:

AFAIR some members here posted sometimes that they like Robben Ford’s 80ies guitar tone (TTYD as an example) a bit better than his 90ies and current guitar tone.

Now Scott (dogears) reported, if I understood him correctly, that the power supply of the "green light / green EQ switches" chassis is still the original "yellow Sprague Atoms" one. And Brandon, ampdork and Scott posted here..
http://ampgarage.com/forum/viewtopic.ph ... hlight=183

now have posted a lot of the current specs of this chassis. And AFAIK it is known here, what will be the most likely differences between the 80ies "low plate classic" configuration and the current "high plate skyline" configuration of this "green light / green EQ switches" chassis.

So based on all that is known now due to the generosity of ampdork, Brandon and Scott, someone with the knowledge needed for amp building will perhaps be able now to build a promising clone of both:

The "green light / green EQ switches" chassis in its 90ies and current "high plate skyline" configuration

More discussion
http://ampgarage.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=12289

Tony

[Suckseeder]

Hmm,so the amp in this video is most likely a Hi Plate Skyliner with a Marshall Cab .
I like the impetuous energy of the young RF. Lot‘s of gain too, PAB ?

[ayan]

Hmm,so the amp in this video is most likely a Hi Plate Skyliner with a Marshall Cab .
I like the impetuous energy of the young RF. Lot‘s of gain too, PAB ?

I used to see a lot of RF in the early 90s, he'd moved back to So Cal and was doing a lot of gigs around LA. I remember liking that tone better at that time than I would just a couple years later. One thing about this era is that, as you pointed out, RF would use the PAB all the time. The transition from OD to DO + PAB was smoother, in terms of the bass content not being that different, which would suggest the amp had a classic tone stack. In addition, the tone control settings were different in the earlier days, with the treble set higher than the mids and the mids higher than the bass. Later on, he would change that and set the bass highest and the treble lowest, which could be explained by the presence of a new tone stack and the 68pF master brightness cap. He pretty mush stopped using the PAB on the overdrive later on as well. One thing I can say is that his amp always had the same characteristics on the high end, with a halo kind of effect on the notes. And like in this video, his signature guitars would often be out of tune.

Gil

[Suckseeder]

thanks Gil,interesting. I guess at this volume and OD plus PAB one can‘t tell,which Tonestack it‘ got. Same goes for Hi or Lo Plates. Very different approach from more recent tunes like ˋRose of Sharon ´,that I like a lot. 30 years make a difference in how you play ,what you play like and how you make it sound

[drew]

The sound quality in that video is kind of miraculously good.

[JD0x0]

The sound quality in that video is kind of miraculously good.

I swear, analog tape made everything sound good, assuming you had a decent mic. Must've been the compression they add.