so how did I do?

[Funkalicousgroove]

If your talking about selling or buy chassis and faceplates? Well then I am guilty and don't care either. If I am going to attempt to make my version of a SSS I need a chassis and faceplate to start with. Not sure what part of that thread link you were referring to.

Sorry Mark, that's not what I meant. I was only referring to the circuit design. Offering chassis, boards, or parts close to cost (as Brandon has, also) is still sharing as far as I'm concerned. That's similar to a group buy set up by an individual. It benefits the group.

The only complaint I have is flaunting an amp which is available for sale on a builder's forum which is searching for information on that very amp.

FYI, Bludotone amp works was incorporated 8/13/04, the first posts made on the Dumble forum were on January 30, 2006, and the idea of the Dumble forum came about from pics I posted on the old t-wreck forum, and Omar asked if I would "champion" the forum until it got off the ground. Scott Lerner, Myself, and a few other folks posted the better part of what is "Known" about these amps, and at the time ALL of what we knew we owed to Mr Gil Ayan. To this day Gil is one of my first calls when I find something new under the goo.

[Sonny ReVerb]

Nevermind...

I apologize for stating an opinion on a web forum - I should know better. I'll try to keep my opinions to myself from now on. I'm all outta piss...

[Tubetwang]

I looked carefully at the two pics...

I'm pretty sure that Mister Alexander is sporting a Black Squier Strat and Mister Bludotone has an American Fender Strat...

Is that it?

Do i win anything??

I usually play a tele but i like strat also...

[dano-rator]

So, anyway... How about -

I'll get some, It's quite a bear to lug around, and I don't have any good recording gear, so I have to take it to a friends house to record it.

I've been salivating and wringing my hands in anticipation!


Dan'l

[Scumback Speakers]

I assure you my opinion of you hasn't changed in the least, and my issue with you is still the same. You are a hypocrite- You clone speakers, and are justified, We clone amps and are wrong? One set of standards will do fine thanks.

LOL. Right. Individuals here clone amps for themselves. You clone amps and SELL them under the Bludotone name, right? Hypocrite? Yes you certainly are, but you just hide behind the forum member thing when you actually are a business, no different than I am. With this post you set yourself up as a much bigger hypocrite, IMO.

I actually recreated a tone no longer offered, despite the Heritage line of speakers coming out AFTER I announced the Scumbacks. They're not accurate pre rola tone speakers. Plus, I actually went to Celestion twice to do this with them (1999 & 2003) and they told me there was no market for these speakers, and they weren't going to offer anything like it. So I at least checked the original maker and was told "You're on your own!" I rather doubt you contacted HAD for the same reasons, and even if you tried, I'm sure you were told no or were not acknowledged. Let's just make that distinction right off the bat.

So please, before you start calling out whatever it is you think you're so superior at in terms of honesty/ethics/originality or whatever over me, you've still done nothing more than clone another amp, put your name on it, and are trying to say you're better than I am.

Sometimes you have to look at yourself through other people's view points, you know. I got a different viewpoint when I joined here, and I understand it, even though I'm not agreeing with it totally.

You, on the other hand, are no better than I am on any front, other than you seem to have a new found knack for being a supermodel. I would stick to building amps, if I were you. I'll stick to speakers and try not to talk any common sense to you.

What you did was tasteless, and disrespectful, just fucking admit it. Sheesh. Who do you think you're fooling anyway?

[Zippy]

What you did was tasteless, and disrespectful, just f@#$ing admit it.

Speaking of tasteless. Do you really need to air this in OUR forum? Yes, "OUR" - it is not just yours to soil with your vitriol.

Sheesh. Who do you think you're fooling anyway?

Fooled me. But then I have no personal agenda. I saw the photo, enjoyed a laugh, and moved on.

Make it a better day.

[les_guitar]

Jim,

Based upon your comments, you now have one less customer.

I can vote with my wallet and I am no longer willing to support your business.

[Scumback Speakers]

I'm not going to take back anything I said on this thread, I posted it, I'll own it and not run away. I've been attacked by Brandon on and off this forum, as I'd heard about it from mutual associates BEFORE I joined here, and before I knew he even existed. My belief is that fact is not well known here. So before anyone thinks I'm unfairly singling him out for an attack, you might wonder why I was.

[ayan]

What you did was tasteless, and disrespectful, just fucking admit it. Sheesh. Who do you think you're fooling anyway?

Hi Jim,

It's not that I want to get in the middle of this, per se, but I would like to articulate a couple of thoughts. The premise that someone is justified in doing something and the next guy is not is something I have a hard time coming to terms with. I appreciate the fact that you went to Celestion and approached them with a business proposal which they dismissed, and the rest is history. As you indicated, you offered something that was no longer available.

I believe it is a fact that Dumble's amps are no longer available for people to buy new. And while this is technically hearsay, I also am under the impression that Dumble is unable to even service his own amps as far as the great majority of his customers are concerned. So this is basically the same situation you described, offering to the masses something which is no longer available. You also indicated that you approached Celestion and they were not interested in partnering with you. I am not sure how getting blown off equals an entitlement to clone, but for the sake of this post, let's assume it is. Would you change your mind if Brandon told you that he had contacted Dumble and offered to do business with him, but was blown off? If that would not change your mind, then I would like to see if it would be possible to find a way for me to understand what it is you feel that sets your case apart from the rest, because I sincerely don't understand the loginc of your argument.

Cheers,

Gil

[Zippy]

So before anyone thinks I'm unfairly singling him out for an attack, you might wonder why I was.

It has nothing to do with history - real/imagined/interpreted. It is everything about how you choose to go forward.

I wish you well.

[Funkalicousgroove]

I assure you my opinion of you hasn't changed in the least, and my issue with you is still the same. You are a hypocrite- You clone speakers, and are justified, We clone amps and are wrong? One set of standards will do fine thanks.

LOL. Right. Individuals here clone amps for themselves. You clone amps and SELL them under the Bludotone name, right? Hypocrite? Yes you certainly are, but you just hide behind the forum member thing when you actually are a business, no different than I am. With this post you set yourself up as a much bigger hypocrite, IMO.

I actually recreated a tone no longer offered, despite the Heritage line of speakers coming out AFTER I announced the Scumbacks. They're not accurate pre rola tone speakers. Plus, I actually went to Celestion twice to do this with them (1999 & 2003) and they told me there was no market for these speakers, and they weren't going to offer anything like it. So I at least checked the original maker and was told "You're on your own!" I rather doubt you contacted HAD for the same reasons, and even if you tried, I'm sure you were told no or were not acknowledged. Let's just make that distinction right off the bat.

So please, before you start calling out whatever it is you think you're so superior at in terms of honesty/ethics/originality or whatever over me, you've still done nothing more than clone another amp, put your name on it, and are trying to say you're better than I am.

Sometimes you have to look at yourself through other people's view points, you know. I got a different viewpoint when I joined here, and I understand it, even though I'm not agreeing with it totally.

You, on the other hand, are no better than I am on any front, other than you seem to have a new found knack for being a supermodel. I would stick to building amps, if I were you. I'll stick to speakers and try not to talk any common sense to you.

What you did was tasteless, and disrespectful, just fucking admit it. Sheesh. Who do you think you're fooling anyway?

Perhaps you should have someone else proof read your posts before you make them, you are only emphasizing my point.

Without my presence I feel strongly that this forum wouldn't be near what it is today, and my issue with you is that you come on public forums all high and mighty, and call cloners thieves, while you yourself are a cloner. If that is not hypocracy I am not sure what is. I am not sure how I am a hypocrite, I share tons of stuff about dumbles here, just because I don't share EVERYTHING I know doesn't mean that you or anyone else are entitled to it, you however, are pretty much a troll (you know, lives under a bridge, eats billy goat gruff) and should really consider something constructive to do with your time.

Here is the post that made me Love Jim the way I do:

I'll say this to anyone who thinks they've cloned someone else's amp.

1) Unless it's discontinued and no longer available, you're a thief.
2) Unless you have the amp being cloned right in front of you, you can't clone it 100%, because wiring is one thing. Wire lead dress, position and spacing of components on the board & chassis DO contribute to the tone. Dumble proved that to me 5 years ago in 20 minutes by changing out two caps with the same value caps (but different construction) in my amps, and moving the two star grounding points a total of 2.5 inches on one side, and 1.75 inches on the other. If you don't believe me, just listen to all of the 18 watt and JTM 45 "clones" compared to a real one.
3) You'll never clone the output tranny unless you send it out to be unwrapped, documented and then rebuilt. Mercury Magnetics proved this on to me, as well. I imagine there are very fine OT's that are "close", but not cloned.
4) As in anything electronic, it can age. OT's, caps, etc. go south, go bad, get soft sounding, so anyone who thinks they've cloned an amp has cloned "am amp" at a particular point in it's life, and it's anyone's guess as to whether it was a "Holy Grail" tone amp, or not. Only your ears can decide that.

If the Komet 60 and Concorde have been diagrammed and cloned, that's too bad. I think Ken, Hogy, et al, should get paid for their research work, and not be ripped off by homebrew DIY guys that think they have a right to their work, and then divulge that to the world, just because they're cheap bastids.

Either work up your own original design, or significantly different design, or just save your money and buy the real thing, it's the only way you can show your appreciation for the work that was done for the product, the tone and all that R&D. You didn't do it, you just wanted it, and didn't want to step up and pay what you should have to get it.

Cheap bastids....it disgusts me to think that people would so arrogantly think they've "cloned" what superior builders such as Ken & Hogy have done. Sheesh...talk about having delusions of grandeur....

[M Fowler]

Funk,

Now I am upset that you are not sharing everything you know.
Now I will have to start thinking for myself on how to build that SSS, rats. Couldn't you just throw this gray haired old dog a bone on my build?

Jim, I haven't tried your Scumbacks but maybe I should it could be the sound that I have been searching for. I sure don't think anyone posting their opinion should be slammed especially so far as for people not to buy your product because of a disagreement between you and Funk. I have no knowledge that Funk actually clones Dumbles either, but rather, he probably expands on the ideas just as the many large amp builders have done since I was a kid.

Mark

[Funkalicousgroove]

I'm not going to take back anything I said on this thread, I posted it, I'll own it and not run away. I've been attacked by Brandon on and off this forum, as I'd heard about it from mutual associates BEFORE I joined here, and before I knew he even existed. My belief is that fact is not well known here. So before anyone thinks I'm unfairly singling him out for an attack, you might wonder why I was.

I think you may have me mixed up with Allyn Meyers (the owner of this forum) since I believe it was him you were attacking in the earlier post that I cited in my warm and heartfelt introduction. I just Call em like I see em. by the way, I just read all 69 of your posts, and at least half of them were hocking your re-labeled weber speakers. At least I help folks here get tones they are after. There is NOTHING that has been posted on this Dumble forum that I didn't know before I came here, and plenty of new info that I posted, whereas YOU contribute nothing-- Lives under a bridge, eats billy goats gruff.

[Funkalicousgroove]

Funk,

Now I am upset that you are not sharing everything you know.
Now I will have to start thinking for myself on how to build that SSS, rats. Couldn't you just throw this gray haired old dog a bone on my build?

Jim, I haven't tried your Scumbacks but maybe I should it could be the sound that I have been searching for. I sure don't think anyone posting their opinion should be slammed especially so far as for people not to buy your product because of a disagreement between you and Funk. I have no knowledge that Funk actually clones Dumbles either, but rather, he probably expands on the ideas just as the many large amp builders have done since I was a kid.

Mark

Send me a PM, that's how I've helped other folks with their SSS amps, at least that way it's not permanently in cyberspace for all to see.

That being said, if you read all the posts I've made you would know what the SSS is, it's a big twin. Skyline EQ into an Ampeg style PI, and the filters are in RDH4, they are a second EQ between the preamp and PI. I'm not going to give anyone a detailed schematic, parts list or anythig like that, and thus far I have shared more about the SSS than ANYONE ELSE on this forum--- I'm done.

[Zippy]

Lives under a bridge, eats billy goats gruff.

Hey, ease up on the real trolls. You're giving them a bad rep'.

I'm kinda sensitive to that line as my first acting gig was the role of the troll in a kindergarten play about a half century ago.