AN Wonderland/JM 100w layout

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norburybrook
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Re: AN Wonderland/JM 100w layout

Post by norburybrook »

I think a lot of it comes down to what we've got used to seeing on the amps we're copying, hence my eyes were draw to the lack of elevated heater wiring on as dumble/fender style amp.

There's nothing stopping you using turrets to make a Dumble style amp and lay the heaters down Marshall style, but we've all got used to seeing the gut shots of the original, and now many beautiful copies made by people on this forum, so we (I) tend to go with the tradition.

when I built my rocket, MIke at Modulus amps on the UK built one at the same time and he ran his heaters, untwisted , around the chassis edge, held in place by the of touch of CA glue. It looked amazing inside :D obviously had no detrimental effect to the sound either.

I'm in the hate doing heater wiring camp :D

M
Bombacaototal
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Re: AN Wonderland/JM 100w layout

Post by Bombacaototal »

Are there any associated issues of having the polarised caps (4.7uF and 10uF) as 25V instead of 50V?
Charlie Wilson
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Re: AN Wonderland/JM 100w layout

Post by Charlie Wilson »

Marcus, I also was wondering about the heater wires when I looked at the photo but if you look real close I think you can see the black and white wires going towards the back panel. Maybe Lovetone was just having a bad day. :) I guess I am the only one who does the heaters last. For me, they get in the way of wiring the tube sockets. I try to get in Zen mode when I do them and make them look nice. I will say however, I don't know how you guys use 18 gauge stranded for heaters. I did it one time and will never use it again. Even the topcoat opens up on me and it is a pain in the ...! The drawback on the solid is that 18 gauge wire breaks real easy if you nick it. Bombacaotal, you can use 25v or 50v cathode caps no problem. I think the 50v have a slightly lower ESR and may give you a slightly firmer low end response. I like 50v Vishay Sprague silver or black.
CW
Bombacaototal
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Re: AN Wonderland/JM 100w layout

Post by Bombacaototal »

Thanks CW! I had ordered them as 25V based on the layot of #102 and 3rd Gen and only today while revising some stuff I realised that AN had it as 50V. Is it a noticeable difference? If that is the case I might order a new batch of 50V.
Charlie Wilson
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Re: AN Wonderland/JM 100w layout

Post by Charlie Wilson »

Bombacaototal wrote:Thanks CW! I had ordered them as 25V based on the layot of #102 and 3rd Gen and only today while revising some stuff I realised that AN had it as 50V. Is it a noticeable difference? If that is the case I might order a new batch of 50V.
Nah I wouldn't worry about it. The difference is subtle. More important to use a decent quality cap. Purple Nichicon or silver or black Sprague.
CW
Bombacaototal
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Re: AN Wonderland/JM 100w layout

Post by Bombacaototal »

Charlie Wilson wrote:
Bombacaototal wrote:Thanks CW! I had ordered them as 25V based on the layot of #102 and 3rd Gen and only today while revising some stuff I realised that AN had it as 50V. Is it a noticeable difference? If that is the case I might order a new batch of 50V.
Nah I wouldn't worry about it. The difference is subtle. More important to use a decent quality cap. Purple Nichicon or silver or black Sprague.
CW
Great! I wish I had asked you for some advice beforehand. I got Sprague TE High Temp (hope it's good enough)
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Re: AN Wonderland/JM 100w layout

Post by Charlie Wilson »

You are good. The TE are the silver ones which I prefer.
CW :)
Bombacaototal
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Re: AN Wonderland/JM 100w layout

Post by Bombacaototal »

Charlie Wilson wrote:You are good. The TE are the silver ones which I prefer.
CW :)
Awesome! I am gutted I did not get them in 50V's

But we learn everyday :)
Bombacaototal
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Re: AN Wonderland/JM 100w layout

Post by Bombacaototal »

ToneMerc wrote:
dorrisant wrote:although, I know this is just a plot to sell more chassis!
Now it gives me an excuse to get that chassis out of the attic! I think I will do a quad 6v6 version.

TM
Assuming you have a correct OT for the 6V6 is there any adjustment that would need to be done on the values of the circuit beyond the bias resistors to accommodate a 2x6V6?

I was checking the D-lite as reference and it seems to use a different GNFB: 6.2k vs 4.7k of 6L6 builts. The rest of the PI is fairly identical. Is this something I should be looking into?

Another question is about the grid resistors for the power tubes. Are you leaving them as 3.4k?
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jelle
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Re: AN Wonderland/JM 100w layout

Post by jelle »

Ok, what is the idea with NFB? What does it do? :D
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ToneMerc
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Re: AN Wonderland/JM 100w layout

Post by ToneMerc »

Bombacaototal wrote:
Assuming you have a correct OT for the 6V6 is there any adjustment that would need to be done on the values of the circuit beyond the bias resistors to accommodate a 2x6V6?

I was checking the D-lite as reference and it seems to use a different GNFB: 6.2k vs 4.7k of 6L6 builts. The rest of the PI is fairly identical. Is this something I should be looking into?

Another question is about the grid resistors for the power tubes. Are you leaving them as 3.4k?
Well, I generally will tweak 6V6 amps differently and no I am not using 3.4k. Here's the thing, sure this layout based on a JM TR amp but you know what, I could care less about JM or the JM tone, whatever that is. I am going to make a few changes and season the amp for my liking. I think that I am more fascinated with the reverb circuit than anything else.

Here's the best advice I can give you; pick up a soldering iron and start making an intimate connection with all that you are reading and apply that practical work to what you are hearing and then use those experiences to seek what you like......that's what matters.

The worse thing that you can do is to tether yourself completely to these layouts.

TM
Bombacaototal
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Re: AN Wonderland/JM 100w layout

Post by Bombacaototal »

jelle wrote:Ok, what is the idea with NFB? What does it do? :D
I've seen some old posts with a lot of confusion about the GNFB which also added a question mark to myself

Here is one:
http://ampgarage.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=606

There were other posts but cannot find them again
Bombacaototal
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Re: AN Wonderland/JM 100w layout

Post by Bombacaototal »

ToneMerc wrote:
Bombacaototal wrote:
Assuming you have a correct OT for the 6V6 is there any adjustment that would need to be done on the values of the circuit beyond the bias resistors to accommodate a 2x6V6?

I was checking the D-lite as reference and it seems to use a different GNFB: 6.2k vs 4.7k of 6L6 builts. The rest of the PI is fairly identical. Is this something I should be looking into?

Another question is about the grid resistors for the power tubes. Are you leaving them as 3.4k?
Well, I generally will tweak 6V6 amps differently and no I am not using 3.4k. Here's the thing, sure this layout based on a JM TR amp but you know what, I could care less about JM or the JM tone, whatever that is. I am going to make a few changes and season the amp for my liking. I think that I am more fascinated with the reverb circuit than anything else.

Here's the best advice I can give you; pick up a soldering iron and start making an intimate connection with all that you are reading and apply that practical work to what you are hearing and then use those experiences to seek what you like......that's what matters.

The worse thing that you can do is to tether yourself completely to these layouts.

TM
Noted with thanks TM. Jelle gave me the exact same advice and indeed this is what I am intending to do :-).
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norburybrook
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Re: AN Wonderland/JM 100w layout

Post by norburybrook »

I don't think it's a bad thing to start out by copying exactly what's on a particular amp schematic/layout when you're a beginner. Once you've built a good working amp you can then start to experiment.

I equate it to cooking, it's always best to start with the classic recipes and follow them exactly until you become familiar with how things interact etc then you can start doing your own thing.

I came to this forum with very little previous knowledge a few years ago and with patience, and enquiring mind and some great people here I've made 4 or 5 amazing sounding amps. I've learned so much from each build and continue to do so.

Marcus
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martin manning
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Re: AN Wonderland/JM 100w layout

Post by martin manning »

norburybrook wrote:I don't think it's a bad thing to start out by copying exactly what's on a particular amp schematic/layout when you're a beginner. Once you've built a good working amp you can then start to experiment.
Which is exactly the advice that has been given here from time to time. Not to say that every amp built to the same layout by different people will sound exactly the same, but it's a place to start.
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