am I ready to build a dumble style amp?

[wsaraceni]

ive built and rebuilt 3 amps so far. none of them came out great. only 1 of them is still together. but I think my main issue with them was that I should have started with a straight up clone. you know, buying a pre-drilled chassis and a set of boards.

the first am I tried at was a trainwreck express. so the dumble is way more parts than that but seems less temperamental. I probably have 90% of the resistors and capacitors I need. so I was thinking of starting with a board and then do chassis and transformers next.


then the bigger problem. picking a model to do. if I had my choice based on sound clips id choose a 50w SSS with reverb. not sure where to start. kinda rambling. but I cant win if I dont play so wish me luck.

[WhopperPlate]

To answer your question: if you have a hard time building an express then any dumble circuit mentioned isn’t going to be any easier . If that concerns you then perhaps consider revisiting your previous build.

ive built and rebuilt 3 amps so far. none of them came out great. only 1 of them is still together.

Define “not great”. What don’t you like? What type if amp do you have left ? Why not make it great?

[bepone]

not sure where to start. kinda rambling. but I cant win if I dont play so wish me luck.

of course you need to go, it is only a fender amp with added overdrive channel, it is not so difficult to assembly.. but soundwise it is very difficult, so use only resistors and capacitors what are on the pictures, dont do any experiment..forget about.

tubes are , but not so important, any will do, new, old, used, worn.. +-30% on the tone, but this is tuning at the end

critical is, with resistors, caps and exact lead dress, output transformer... old fender SF/BF for great results,

if you respect above rules, result will be there

[ChopSauce]

How about me feeling like building a Dumble with your background sounds like willing to "fly" as in "fly or fight"?

Isn't there any amp you could clone with the several parts you already have, first, so you could then start a Dumble build more confidently - maybe?

[Stephen1966]

I guess if you have to ask yourself that question, the answer is "no". But that shouldn't stop you anyway.

Best place to start is to choose the topology - the amp most interesting to you. With all the NOS parts in the world, it still isn't going to be an instant success. Once you've identified your desired amp/sound the next step (for me at least) is to find out everything you can about it - not forgetting, the ground scheme. The #124 is very well documented. SSSs too. With a schematic/layout, or possibly both, you can then start putting your BOM together. NOS parts will give you a head start but they aren't the whole equation and modern in-production parts can be made to work. Nothing against PCBs personally, but if you dig around I think you will find some great board templates by Martin Manning. Having the correct "circuit constants" for which, read distance around components on a board, will get you a little closer again. Transformers contribute, lead dress contributes, tubes contribute, speaker and cab contribute... everything can contribute...

The devil is in the details; it isn't a single thing that leads to a successful amp but a combination of factors that all contribute towards the sum, greater than its parts.

Nothing's greater than when it all comes together though - so, don't give up. You will probably have a few (more) grey hairs at the end but you are surrounded by some wonderful, talented people here.

[wsaraceni]

To answer your question: if you have a hard time building an express then any dumble circuit mentioned isn’t going to be any easier . If that concerns you then perhaps consider revisiting your previous build.

ive built and rebuilt 3 amps so far. none of them came out great. only 1 of them is still together.

Define “not great”. What don’t you like? What type if amp do you have left ? Why not make it great?

I built the express. it was fine. just not the amp for me. then I gutted a small fender combo and built an 18 watt lite. that thing ripped, but at the time I had a komet 19 that did the same thing better. so I gutted that, and gutted the trainwreck and tried to build a rocket/zwreck style 18 watt.

by not great its just not a great sounding amp. it works. the voltages are where they should be. I just dont love it. id consider gutting that or modding that, but I think modding an amp would be more difficult to learn than cloning something else. as it was, cloning a rocket and a ac15 and putting them together as something thats not exactly either took a while to get running as im more of an amateur assembler level than a designer level amp builder.

I know I could pull off a more complicated "kit"

but by kit I mean if I had a layout, schematic, and BOM I could pull it off. especially with some online help. problem I have with jumping in the deep end with dumble is to seems that its kinda like picking pieces of a puzzle and going from there. like I cant just find a fully thought out 50w SSS or even a 100 watt SSS. its confusing when you look at it as a specific amp. a lot to digest. it seems ceriatone seems to be the closest resource for what im looking for, but ive never really considered them

[wsaraceni]

I guess if you have to ask yourself that question, the answer is "no". But that shouldn't stop you anyway.

Best place to start is to choose the topology - the amp most interesting to you. With all the NOS parts in the world, it still isn't going to be an instant success. Once you've identified your desired amp/sound the next step (for me at least) is to find out everything you can about it - not forgetting, the ground scheme. The #124 is very well documented. SSSs too. With a schematic/layout, or possibly both, you can then start putting your BOM together. NOS parts will give you a head start but they aren't the whole equation and modern in-production parts can be made to work. Nothing against PCBs personally, but if you dig around I think you will find some great board templates by Martin Manning. Having the correct "circuit constants" for which, read distance around components on a board, will get you a little closer again. Transformers contribute, lead dress contributes, tubes contribute, speaker and cab contribute... everything can contribute...

The devil is in the details; it isn't a single thing that leads to a successful amp but a combination of factors that all contribute towards the sum, greater than its parts.

Nothing's greater than when it all comes together though - so, don't give up. You will probably have a few (more) grey hairs at the end but you are surrounded by some wonderful, talented people here.

Funny enough. the SSS is the one that interests me the most. ive never fully understood the Dumble overdrive options and ive played a few amps inspired by that like some two rocks, Fuchs, a real dumble, and a few clones. ive even heard more in person. the only ones I really liked that I heard in person were the emerald pro, the ts-1, and one or two that I ended up in a room made by jelle I believe. I dont know. its as so many years ago but I think that's whose amps they were.

[martin manning]

...then the bigger problem. picking a model to do. if I had my choice based on sound clips id choose a 50w SSS with reverb. not sure where to start. kinda rambling. but I cant win if I dont play so wish me luck.

The Express is a very simple circuit with some need for careful lead dress. Good experience builder.

The ODS is a step up in complexity. Same tube count (for a 50W), but it has multiple boards and more controls, plus the FET booster circuit. It also needs careful lead dress. It's well documented, with many examples. There are two basic types, ODS and ODS HRM/Bluesmaster

he SSS is another step up, with four more tubes (3 for the reverb and 1 for the CF driver), more boards, and more controls. Ryan C's documentation is complete, but there has been some iteration around the bias circuit. Personally, I would go with the bipolar supply I posted some years ago.

Whatever you do, the first step is to secure a compatible set of chassis, transformers, and boards. I don't get excited about resistor brands or types (CF or MF, no CC), but stick with the same dielectric types for the caps.

[wsaraceni]

...then the bigger problem. picking a model to do. if I had my choice based on sound clips id choose a 50w SSS with reverb. not sure where to start. kinda rambling. but I cant win if I dont play so wish me luck.

The Express is a very simple circuit with some need for careful lead dress. Good experience builder.

The ODS is a step up in complexity. Same tube count (for a 50W), but it has multiple boards and more controls, plus the FET booster circuit. It also needs careful lead dress. It's well documented, with many examples. There are two basic types, ODS and ODS HRM/Bluesmaster

he SSS is another step up, with four more tubes (3 for the reverb and 1 for the CF driver), more boards, and more controls. Ryan C's documentation is complete, but there has been some iteration around the bias circuit. Personally, I would go with the bipolar supply I posted some years ago.

Whatever you do, the first step is to secure a compatible set of chassis, transformers, and boards. I don't get excited about resistor brands or types (CF or MF, no CC), but stick with the same dielectric types for the caps.

thanks for the summary. maybe ill hold off a bit and research a bunch more. the SSS seems way too complicated when you put it like that

[WhopperPlate]

id consider gutting that or modding that, but I think modding an amp would be more difficult to learn than cloning something else.

If the amp is already built then any simple modifications are arguably much easier to attempt and derive some experience tweaking that custom circuit of yours.

You can always try swapping different composition and brand components and values to get some ideas and experience of how things sound and react to changes.

You may not build your keeper, but it may boost your confidence before jumping into the dumbleland

[Stephen1966]

I guess if you have to ask yourself that question, the answer is "no". But that shouldn't stop you anyway.

Best place to start is to choose the topology - the amp most interesting to you. With all the NOS parts in the world, it still isn't going to be an instant success. Once you've identified your desired amp/sound the next step (for me at least) is to find out everything you can about it - not forgetting, the ground scheme. The #124 is very well documented. SSSs too. With a schematic/layout, or possibly both, you can then start putting your BOM together. NOS parts will give you a head start but they aren't the whole equation and modern in-production parts can be made to work. Nothing against PCBs personally, but if you dig around I think you will find some great board templates by Martin Manning. Having the correct "circuit constants" for which, read distance around components on a board, will get you a little closer again. Transformers contribute, lead dress contributes, tubes contribute, speaker and cab contribute... everything can contribute...

The devil is in the details; it isn't a single thing that leads to a successful amp but a combination of factors that all contribute towards the sum, greater than its parts.

Nothing's greater than when it all comes together though - so, don't give up. You will probably have a few (more) grey hairs at the end but you are surrounded by some wonderful, talented people here.

Funny enough. the SSS is the one that interests me the most. ive never fully understood the Dumble overdrive options and ive played a few amps inspired by that like some two rocks, Fuchs, a real dumble, and a few clones. ive even heard more in person. the only ones I really liked that I heard in person were the emerald pro, the ts-1, and one or two that I ended up in a room made by jelle I believe. I dont know. its as so many years ago but I think that's whose amps they were.

Just go for it man! Do your research and you will know when it's time. You seem to be a critical listener... that's what counts IMHO. Just don't expect it to work first time. Small steps...

[martin manning]

If you can get a chassis and board set you have the essence of a kit. SSS is not a cheap date, though.

[timrobertson100]

I can’t recommend the SSS#2 PCB set and chassis sold by Ryan (US) and Erwin (EU) enough. It’s excellent quality stuff, several of us have built them so can help, and the result sounds fabulous.

In my experience, it’s best building the amp I really want.

Edited to add: the Wonderland amp is another fabulous one in a similar style to the SSS, simpler to build, and chassis and eyelet boards go for sale here too (Amplified Nation plus others)

[dorrisant]

Try converting your Express into a Rocket, or Rockster instead (since you already have the octal sockets there). It is close to the same parts count but much more forgiving to build.

In basketball, seeing the ball go through the hoop from a short distance has a psychological affect on the brain in that it makes it easier to make a second shot from a step or two back. Meaning... Give yourself an easier goal to obtain before trying a harder one. The success will help advance your skills to the next level. This principal applies to so many things in life, it is amazing.

You have probably heard the phrase "baby steps". Same principal, same reasoning.

[wsaraceni]

Try converting your Express into a Rocket, or Rockster instead (since you already have the octal sockets there). It is close to the same parts count but much more forgiving to build.

In basketball, seeing the ball go through the hoop from a short distance has a psychological affect on the brain in that it makes it easier to make a second shot from a step or two back. Meaning... Give yourself an easier goal to obtain before trying a harder one. The success will help advance your skills to the next level. This principal applies to so many things in life, it is amazing.

You have probably heard the phrase "baby steps". Same principal, same reasoning.

My express is now a rocket. At least somewhat. It’s something like an 18 watt z wreck and 18 watt rocket mixed together. I used 18 watt Marshall transformers though.