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[Tag]

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[Steven_nl]

Hi Tag
yes
I use a Dumble clone and it does seem to be fairly middly. sometimes I feel there's a bit of a blanket over the sound of the amp. raising the Presence (higher then does make a huge difference.
Not sure this is what Tag means but curious to hear answers to this one.

ps have you guys heard this?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uUevIQLWKTg

[Funkalicousgroove]

Are you comparing apples to apples? IE are there EL34 Tubes and appropriate Trannies in the clones you are comparing to your Dumble? El34's have a different EQ curve all together.

are you comparing amps that are Skyline with Standard Overdrive?

Are you comparing 100W amps?

Same guitar, speakers, cables, effects?

You can take the ACTUAL measurement of your Mid cap (caps have a tolerance of +/- 20%) if it says .01uf but actually measures .00899 then you'd have more mids.

[Structo]

When I plug the numbers into the Tone Stack Calculator the mid control (250KA) doesn't really change the wave form at all.

That is with a .002uf treble cap and a 390pf on the mid boost.

Here is a sweep with a 300pf and .002uf treble cap.

The one with the higher mid level is with the mid boost on. (.002uf)

[ayan]

Are you comparing apples to apples? IE are there EL34 Tubes and appropriate Trannies in the clones you are comparing to your Dumble? El34's have a different EQ curve all together.

are you comparing amps that are Skyline with Standard Overdrive?

Are you comparing 100W amps?

Same guitar, speakers, cables, effects?

You can take the ACTUAL measurement of your Mid cap (caps have a tolerance of +/- 20%) if it says .01uf but actually measures .00899 then you'd have more mids.

For Tag's sake, so as to avoid confusion:

1. Increasing the size of the Treble cap (normally .0022uF at the board and 390pF at the "Mid" switch -- and this is for amps with a "Mid" as opposed to a "Deep" switch) will thicken the sound. To me, with the switch off, the increase in the cap value is perceived as an increase in the higher mids.

2. Also, DECREASING the size of the Mid cap at the board (.01uF for a Skyliner EQ amp) will definitely increase the lower mids.

As Brandon indicated, there are a LOT of other things that play a role as well. So looking at just these two caps will definitely only tell a partial story.

Gil

[Tonegurus]

The Glaswerks SOD II has three 3-way magical mini toggles that shift those EQ curves around exceedingly well.

Mike

[talbany]

A few other things to consider

Types of caps.. 6PS or MPP's

High or low plate... Bypass caps

Types of treble caps Ceramic or Mica

Value of mid pot is it really 250K and the right taper

Age and amount of hours on the amp

Or maybe the formica....Nah!!

Not to confuse... Just consider



Tony

[heisthl]

The one thing I have noticed that is a constant with Dumble clones is that the mids are not shifted low enough. At least compared to my Dumble and what I hear in Fords. When I bought a Quinn ODS, I wanted Shad to install a 330 treble cap as this is what Scott L. had thought was making my E.Pro so smooth. Well, Shad suggested he put a push pull pot on the treble knob so I could go between the two. Surprising to me was that it did not sem to change the treble much or smooth the amp, but it did seem to shift the mids lower going to the 500. It eneded up I liked both, using the 330 with a Strat and Tele most of the time, and the 500 for humbuckers and a the tele as well. In any case, what can I do to lower the mids even lower? Its not huge, but is noticable, and IMO, part of the Dumble magic, and part of what the clones are missing. I dont care exactly what part Dumble actually used, as that does not seem to be doing it. Will going to an even higher value lower the mids a bit more without changeing the treble, or is there something else that can be done? I can post clips of a comparison where you can hear what I am talking about if that would be helpful. You can hear it as either a lower mid shift, or an upper mid scoop. It seems it should be fairly simple to do. Thanks for any help!!

Simpler explanation - The treble cap sets the amount of upper mids, bigger = more. The mid cap connected to the midrange control sets the "scoop" (lo mids) A fender twin uses a .047 which is very scooped and great for country. A fender Super reverb uses a .02 which is less scooped and is great for blues. A Dumble uses a .01 and is the least scooped of all and is best for fusion. When you experiment with those 3 values you will also notice that the bass control has a greater range of bass available when the mid cap is the smallest. Hope this helps - Henry

P.S. Tag - tones your Dumble won't do - http://soundclick.com/share?songid=8458490

[butwhatif]

My pref is the .047-.05 mid cap. It can do a scoop, but also provides the meat of the sound beyond what the treb cap will do. It can also provide lots of lo mid. I have .01 and .047 on a pull pot, but it usually is in the .047 position, as the .01 provides ice pick mids, as opposed to the 'thick' provided
by the .047. This is mostly w/ a LP w/ real pafs. but w/single coil pu's i usually have to decrease the bass+mid a bit.

[Tag]

jjjjjjjjjjjjj

[heisthl]

the .01 provides ice pick mids, .

Not possible - there is nothing "ice picky" about using a .01 listen to almost every Dumble Skyliner ever made.

[heisthl]

Simpler explanation - The treble cap sets the amount of upper mids, bigger = more. The mid cap connected to the midrange control sets the "scoop" (lo mids) A fender twin uses a .047 which is very scooped and great for country. A fender Super reverb uses a .02 which is less scooped and is great for blues. A Dumble uses a .01 and is the least scooped of all and is best for fusion. When you experiment with those 3 values you will also notice that the bass control has a greater range of bass available when the mid cap is the smallest. Hope this helps - Henry

P.S. Tag - tones your Dumble won't do - http://soundclick.com/share?songid=8458490

Thanks! That makes sense. So what would be the easiest and best way in your opinion to shift the mids down slightly, OR, scoop the upper mids slightly? Someone posted a clip of my Dumble earlier, and I think you can hear it pretty clear in the clip. Its like a LACK of upper mids, or a surge in lower mids. Which one it is I dont know. An example of an amp that is very close is the TwoRock Sig V1 or Artist, where as the earlier Custom reverb did not have it. Whatever twoRock did for the sig 1 shifted them down a bit.

You are right! My Dumble does not sound anything like that clip at all. That sounds almost like a Tweed on steroids. Very different and very nice!
[/quote] Why speculate - just get a couple clip leads and add some different values of caps in parallel with the .01 mid cap you have there now. Try a .01 first (for the equivalent of a .02) and see if you need to go upwards or downwards from there. You may have to scrape some goop to get to the clip lead point where the mid cap and slope resistor meet. The other clip lead can attach directly to the mid pot.

[Tag]

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[Tag]

hhhhhhh

[Structo]

Sorry to derail but I really like this tune and tone that Garth recorded.

http://www.soundclick.com/bands/page_so ... ID=8287110