Full wave vs full wave bridge rectifier?

[sluckey]

You may have missed some info in that wiki article...

wiki.jpg

[lightfoot]

You may have missed some info in that wiki article...
wiki.jpg

OK I see where the confusion originated from based on my initial research. When I read “four diodes in a bridge configuration”, I wasn’t clear at the time as to which rectifier was being referred to as a bridge configuration. The four diodes like the one in the fender schematic or four diode with a ground reference on the negative side? All of you seem to be suggesting that both diode configurations can be referred to with the same Terminology.

As I continued to read down the wiki article I finally scrolled down to a diagram that is basically the same one that’s installed in the amplifier right now and they are referring to that configurations as a “voltage multiplier”. Am I miss reading this?

[bepone]

Termanology.

[sluckey]

As I continued to read down the wiki article I finally scrolled down to a diagram that is basically the same one that’s installed in the amplifier right now and they are referring to that configurations as a “voltage multiplier”. Am I miss reading this?

Yes. The pic in that section clearly uses the word "bridge", not once, but twice.

I can't think of anything else to say about this so I'll drop off the line.

[lightfoot]

As I continued to read down the wiki article I finally scrolled down to a diagram that is basically the same one that’s installed in the amplifier right now and they are referring to that configurations as a “voltage multiplier”. Am I miss reading this?

Yes. The pic in that section clearly uses the word "bridge", not once, but twice.

I can't think of anything else to say about this so I'll drop off the line.

Sorry I’m trying to reconcile all this information in the middle of a workday. Maybe engaging in this conversation while I’m working was a bad idea from the beginning…

[martin manning]

The Fender schematic snip and the pencil sketch you posted are both full wave bridge rectifier circuits. I think the thing that threw everybody off was your use of the term Artificial Center Tap, which is another subject entirely. The voltage multiplier above is a novel way to convert a full wave bridge to a voltage doubler, where the B+ can be either the same as a FWB or twice that value. That said, the Wikipedia article you linked is just fine with respect to describing full wave and full wave bridge circuits. See under Rectifier Circuits, Single Phase Rectifiers.

[lightfoot]

The Fender schematic snip and the pencil sketch you posted are both full wave bridge rectifier circuits. I think the thing that threw everybody off was your use of the term Artificial Center Tap, which is another subject entirely. The voltage multiplier above is a novel way to convert a full wave bridge to a voltage doubler, where the B+ can be either the same as a FWB or twice that value. That said, the Wikipedia article you linked is just fine with respect to describing full wave and full wave bridge circuits. See under Rectifier Circuits, Single Phase Rectifiers.

At least I have a better grasp of design terms and it seems as if there shouldn’t be any concerns as far as any risk to the PT with the current rectifier that’s in use now.

[bepone]

Sorry I’m trying to reconcile all this information in the middle of a workday. Maybe engaging in this conversation while I’m working was a bad idea from the beginning…

it is very simple, in the past there was double secondary (single current) for the reason of valve rectifier use. other rectifiers were big and expensive also. today only one secondary needed (double current), you can use cheap diodes.

still you can find many power transformers for guitar use nowadays, which have traditional double secondaries so you can use any rectif. which you want. with single secondary you need to go only to bridge diodes option not with vacuum rectifier (it is still possible though, bridge w. diodes+vacuum rectifier at the end.)

[T Wilcox]

You choose the rectifier type based on the PT voltages and the B+ desired when designing
A good reference would be to look at and compare the schem of the Marshall 2203 and 2204
Youll see the PT for the 100Watt 2203 has half the sec output voltage as the 2204 (like 175/175 vs 350/0/350) but uses a Full wave (no bridge) to arrive at similar B+

[sluckey]

Youll see the PT for the 100Watt 2203 has half the sec output voltage as the 2204 (like 175/175 vs 350/0/350) but uses a Full wave (no bridge) to arrive at similar B+

That sounds a bit twisted. Just to be absolutely clear...

The 2203 uses a FWB (full wave bridge). The PT is 175-0-175 but the CT is not used.

The 2204 uses a conventional full wave rectifier. The PT is 350-0-350 and the CT is used.

[bepone]

You choose the rectifier type based on the PT voltages and the B+ desired when designing

no, you order transformer which you need to follow your design goals.

[T Wilcox]

You choose the rectifier type based on the PT voltages and the B+ desired when designing

no, you order transformer which you need to follow your design goals.

And, if you already have a transformer with specific voltages?
Yes basically you need to know what transformer and which rectifier if you are the designer to know the resulting B+

[T Wilcox]

Youll see the PT for the 100Watt 2203 has half the sec output voltage as the 2204 (like 175/175 vs 350/0/350) but uses a Full wave (no bridge) to arrive at similar B+

That sounds a bit twisted. Just to be absolutely clear...

The 2203 uses a FWB (full wave bridge). The PT is 175-0-175 but the CT is not used.

The 2204 uses a conventional full wave rectifier. The PT is 350-0-350 and the CT is used.

Man I'm at work just trying to post and run and your making me do homework LOL
In my case I had built a 50 watt and 100 watt head of the same amp using Marshall power section. The preamp doesnt matter in this story

I used a Hammond 290HX for the 100W it is 350Vct. The CT is used and connects to the can cap
see layout https://ceriatone.com/british-style-jcm800-2203-hw/

For the 50W I used a Hammond 290GX. It is 690Vct. The CT is grounded
see layout here https://ceriatone.com/british-style-jcm800-2204-hw/

Hope this clears things up

[sluckey]

Hope this clears things up

I figured you knew what you were talking about. Not so sure lightfoot could follow.

[bepone]

And, if you already have a transformer with specific voltages?
Yes basically you need to know what transformer and which rectifier if you are the designer to know the resulting B+

nothing, u use transformer what you have, there are not so many standards, all the 50W/100V amps are working on 440-480V, so you need AC from 340-360V,
it is very simple