debt free

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Andy Le Blanc
Posts: 2582
Joined: Sat Dec 22, 2007 1:16 am
Location: central Maine

Re: debt free

Post by Andy Le Blanc »

Its an interesting place where perception, reality, and cultural indoctrination collide.

The town I live in still has town meetings, the state is representative by county etc.
You can see and understand the model, and why its cumbersome, you can see
and understand why the federal system is fragmented and divided,

You can also see where there probably should be allowed, for the public good,
areas that need public scrutiny, like lobbyist/congressman meetings.
Full reporting and scrutiny. Other wise it deprives you and me of our representation.

May be its a systematic issue where the office of your representative holds
not enough accountability. Public reporting may be the legislative requirement that disallows
the lobby greater sway than the constituency that elected the rep in the first place.

Other wise the senator will use any power of their office at their discretion
regardless of the true public desire.

The system was designed around the assumption of public ignorance,
are you and I really so hopelessly uneducated in this day and age that
we can't demand real disclosure and accountability of our elected
representatives, other than the reelection process, Which seems to be
more a cash and carry affair.

If you can get your state to make non-disclosure of lobbyist/representative interactions
a reason to impeach and forfeit their offices, The mechanisms by which
the Fed and like governmental structures are used in a non-representational manner can be limited.
Public accountability and transparency.
lazymaryamps
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drhulsey
Posts: 986
Joined: Sun Mar 18, 2007 3:19 am

Re: debt free

Post by drhulsey »

Andy Le Blanc wrote: ...The system was designed around the assumption of public ignorance,...
While I don't agree with that evaluation of the ORIGINAL design, it certainly has developed that way. It was drawn up at a time when information was difficult to spread. Congress had to fan out to their constituents to spread the info. "Citizen" legislators instead of career politicians were meant to keep the federal government in contact with the citizenry. I don't think there was meant to be nearly as much information to pass on at the federal level as there was at the state and local level. If you read what the authors of the constitution wrote about the process, the federal government was meant to be SMALL. Most of the activity was to be left to the states where information was easier to disseminate. Those writers knew about the human lust for power and tried to write the Constitution in such a way as to prevent that from happening at the federal level.
The problem is, federal politicians learned to take little liberties with their powers, and the people either didn't notice or didn't have the same voracious appetite for freedom from such things as the FF's. As frequently happens when you give things away, those politicians began to see more widespread power as their right.
I agree with Andy that we need to replace any federal politician who won't be restricted by the Constitution. I still feel that the original outline of power structure for this country is appropriate for today. BUT, We the People have to shoulder more of the responsibilities we have abandoned to the federal government. We didn't want to be bothered with caring for the truly needy, so we let the government do it. We didn't want to be bothered with taking care of our parents, so we let the government develop Medicare. Since it is a well known fact that the federal government can't do ANYTHING with economic efficiency, those programs are now killing our economy.
Andy is also right when he says our economy can't respond in a free market fashion because of all the artificial maneuvers by the government and the Fed. That can theoretically be changed!
We better use the mid-term elections to make some changes. That's the mechanism we were given for peaceful revolution, and we better pay attention and VOTE!
Tim

In case the NSA is listening, KMA!
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dartanion
Posts: 1562
Joined: Fri Mar 23, 2007 9:02 pm
Location: San Jose, CA
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Re: debt free

Post by dartanion »

Yes, change things with our votes! However limited that may be, it's about all we can do by conforming to their system. Our gov't is not only unconstitutional, but also above the law. Apparently our own laws don't apply to most politicians since you have guys like Dick Cheney who gloat about committing crimes on our public TV/Radio air waves while we all sit here in a gov't designed and media executed stupor waiting for a political messiah. That isn't going to happen unless this country wakes up and smells the constitution burning.

How soon do think G-Men would show up at our doors if we start calling for a constitutional convention? It's time to reorganize the gov't, fix our debt based economy, and rid ourselves of this unduly burdensome gov't.
Eardrums!!! We don't need no stinkin' eardrums!
Andy Le Blanc
Posts: 2582
Joined: Sat Dec 22, 2007 1:16 am
Location: central Maine

Re: debt free

Post by Andy Le Blanc »

that's not a bad Idea..... to hell with a tea party.... A constitutional crisis
all over the media will scare the piss out the buggers.

Government seems to be broken, time for a new clause in the founding document.

Congressional conduct and transparency

It must insure that we have true representation in congress.
lazymaryamps
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Aurora
Posts: 762
Joined: Mon May 26, 2008 7:51 am
Location: Norway - north of the moral circle!

Re: debt free

Post by Aurora »

I hope you don't mind me commenting on this, - sometimes I do find garage talks quite interesting..
From a european POV I think one of the major flaws of your system is the financial sponsoring of your politicians. Financial sponsoring is common also in Europe, but over here it's usually in the form of financial support to a political party or movement, not to individual candidates.
In your system it is most likely that the individula who raises most of the doe gets elected - usually. This must for sure create bonds that are questionable at best....???
Andy Le Blanc
Posts: 2582
Joined: Sat Dec 22, 2007 1:16 am
Location: central Maine

Re: debt free

Post by Andy Le Blanc »

And the republican stacked supreme court just removed a hundred years
of election finance reform, corruption at its most fundamental.
Ayn Rand, libertarian, proposed a completely laisssez-faire approach to
governance, even fraud should left to it own course and the market will
correct naturally. This is a core republican ideology. Free market, limited government.
This flies in the face of practical and democratic civil society and fosters the conditions that which
gave rise to Marxism, Th United States of America is becoming a modern example
of the great gulf that separates the bourgeoisie and the proletarians.

American democracy has always been hoped to function as a great social compromise between these extremes.

We are of course a revolutionary society, as much as any other.
Democracy stands betwixt the human calamities of a totalitarian capitalism and
a dictatorship of the proletariat. The current American politic has been
allowed to drift so far to the right that equitable representation has been
lost, at the expense of any democratic resolution.
lazymaryamps
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drhulsey
Posts: 986
Joined: Sun Mar 18, 2007 3:19 am

Re: debt free

Post by drhulsey »

Andy Le Blanc wrote: ... supreme court just removed a hundred years
of election finance reform...
I agree and so does 80% of everyone else.
Andy Le Blanc wrote: ... even fraud should left to it own course and the market will correct naturally...
If we don't follow the law, it's not a free market.
Andy Le Blanc wrote:... American democracy has always been hoped to function as a great social compromise
It's meant to insure equal OPPORTUNITY not equal SHARES.
Neither party has a lock on big government, fraud, or corruption!
We can't tolerate dishonesty!
Tim

In case the NSA is listening, KMA!
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