Where/how to start selling amps?

[Cliff Schecht]

The subject says it, I'm not really sure where and how to go about selling builds online. I've sold very few locally that weren't commissioned builds. I have a few amps that are ready to go and I'm working on getting some clips with pro players made but I'm not sure what the best avenue is. My first thought is TDPRI but I don't have a big reputation there (although my buddy Wally has over 10k posts there and would vouch for me).

My amps are all one off type builds that I put a lot of time and effort into (as well as good quality components). Since a lot of times I reuse old equipment, things aren't labeled at all. It would take some working knowledge of tube amps to operate these (albeit not that much, just not good first amps).

Any advice is greatly appreciated (and hopefully can help others too!).

[Cantplay]

Form an LLC, and make a company webpage.

Do a photo shoot with bikini models,.

Get some amazing players and make a few youtube vids.

Send camera ready art and press releases to the big guitar mags.

John

[xtian]

I've had some luck buying/selling on TGP. Free ads, anyway.

[briane]

Ive had a few shops want to carry my stuff on commission.

Since a lot of times I reuse old equipment

that seems like a big no-no and a legal mess if your selling builds. Big safety issue potentially too.

I give people lifetime warranty to calm any sweaty palms - cant do that with old parts. If something blew up - how do you know if its a bad part or they ran the amp without a load?

[JazzGuitarGimp]

I give people lifetime warranty to calm any sweaty palms - cant do that with old parts. If something blew up - how do you know if its a bad part or they ran the amp without a load?

A lifetime warranty implies that you're going to fix the amp either way. So does it really matter if the issue was an old, bad part?

[Phil_S]

Form an LLC,

This probably won't help. LLC means limited liability corporation. In general, it shields the owner from being personally responsible for certain things, for example defaulting on a bank loan, unless you gave a personal guarantee.

Here is a reasonably good and brief read on the kind of protection you get from an LLC http://www.nolo.com/legal-encyclopedia/ ... guide.html In particular, look at "Personal Liability for Your Own Actions." If you do the building and you have no employees, you are not protected in case of negligence by the corporate veil.

If you get into forming a business entity, you should not do this without the benefit of a lawyer and a tax accountant. It gets complicated very quickly.

Are you sure you want to do this?

Maybe you are better off selling on eBay (I'm not really sure if you are) and stating that it is an amateur level build (yes, I know you are an engineer, Cliff) with no express or implied warranty of any kind.

The problem here is the liability has what we call a long tail. It is one thing to take a commission from someone you know and trust and quite another to sell to a stranger who will have no regard for you when he melts the amp and burns down his house because he didn't know enough to plug in a speaker.

IMHO, if you must do this, you are far better off doing it by word of mouth if you can. I understand that won't generate sales in the same way you might if you had a commercial presence.

[Cliff Schecht]

I have started an LLC and got a tax number really so I could become a CE Dist. customer. I also know that it doesn't cover my ass completely because of someone elses negligence (and/or my own).

That's why I'm so reluctant to sell to the general public. Shit I might try posting these on Facebook and see if any friends are interested. Just need to get some video clips put together first.

Thanks for the comments so far guys. Please don't be afraid to be frank, I can handle the truth .

Are you sure you want to do this?

No, I hate selling my amps but I need the money. I might be better off selling my unused parts, but that's a lot of stuff that I want to use eventually!

[NickC]

I will relate one true story from back in my days as VP-Finance for a pharmaceutical firm. It should demonstrate the extreme fringe of what some folks will say and do in an effort to bamboozle companies.

One of our product lines was the highest quality nutritional supplements available. A complaint letter arrived from a purported customer. The woman claimed she had been taking one of our calcium supplements for over a month. She claimed the tablets were passing through her digestive system undigested, and that she became aware of that when a plumber pulled over 30 calcium tablets out from her toilet trap. She wanted money to compensate her for the undissolved calcium tablets and the plumbers bill. I'm sure every one here knows how a flush toilet works, and the impossibility of her claim.

So, my question to you is this: do you want to risk selling anything to her, or someone like her? If so, consider some really good business insurance.

[Structo]

Yes, unethical people abound.

I would not sell to the public without first incorporating a business for protection from fraud.
Also an umbrella insurance policy ( a good idea for anyone).

Say a guy buys your amp and you didn't follow the latest UL or CE regulations to a T and he sticks his finger where he shouldn't. (maybe he did, maybe he didn't)

Claims he was shocked and has nerve damage as a result.( has doctor testify to this)
Sues you for medical costs and punitive damages. (pain and suffering)
Also claims he will never be the same after this incident.

The world is ripe with scumballs that spend their days looking for a way scam people out of money.

Yeah, I don't have a great deal of faith in my fellow man, always been wary of ripoffs.

Your best bet unless you want to go the whole nine yards for a business is to sell on eBay or similar and sell the amp as "like new" but used.

[cbass]

There is a family here that had a nice cabin by the river.SOme dipshits broke into and cooked some meth.Blowed the place all to hell.KIlled two of em.The third one lived, sued and eneded up getting a settlement.For blowing up a cabin they broke into to cook meth.I think something like that would push me over the edge.Instead of hiring an attorney I'd hire a hitman.

[vibratoking]

Hitmen have loose lips...there are better ways.

[selloutrr]

Form an LLC, and make a company webpage.

Do a photo shoot with bikini models,.

Get some amazing players and make a few youtube vids.

Send camera ready art and press releases to the big guitar mags.

John

Agreed go two steps farther give an amp to a pro commercial recording studio to use rent free.

Get your amp in the hands of a famous player with a contract to display/endorse the amplifier.

A gimmick or something that makes your amp special and stand out

Have a good name and logo

[LeftyStrat]

Agreed go two steps farther give an amp to a pro commercial recording studio to use rent free.

Get your amp in the hands of a famous player with a contract to display/endorse the amplifier.

A gimmick or something that makes your amp special and stand out

Have a good name and logo

This is seriously good advice, and the first item is something I believe Andy Marshall (no not that Marshall, THD) did here in Seattle when they were first gearing up.

In fact the story goes that the local rental had "the" tweed Bassman. It had been converted to use EL34's, and everyone went gaga over it when they heard it. Andy went on a Holy Grail mission to clone that amp, and that was his first product. He even had speakers made. They were ceramic but had a alnico vibe. I have two of the surplus waiting for a project.

Guitar Center should be the last place on the list you want to get into. Start by getting your amps into places where better players are exposed to them.

Have a strong brand name and identity. Concentrate on a few models so you can use that engineering degree to concentrate on the side most young engineers hate, reducing manufacturing costs.

Remember that even though Alexander was pretty much a one man operation and his amps were all somewhat one-offs, he still had very professional graphic designs and a continuity of product lines.

"I can build you anything you want" is possibly the worst thing you can say to a prospective customer. They haven't devoted time to studying amp designs. Start with two or three models to please a majority of the market. And don't neglect markets and music you may not be into. Some of my early work was for a death metal band that later became quite successful, I'm even credited on their first album. It's stuff I can barely listen to. But the guitarist is a really nice guy and I listened to his needs.

I used to think you had to live in a big market to succeed, but Germino has done pretty well living in the Carolinas.

[LeftyStrat]

And I will add, really think about this presentation:

http://www.ted.com/talks/view/lang/en//id/848

[sepulchre]

That's interesting, Lefty. Good stuff!