The amp works! I got very direct with it using 2 gator clips and an old speaker cable I had made out of an extension cord a long time ago. I haven't checked voltages with the speaker load on the amp yet, but tomorrow I will. Check out the video: http://youtu.be/ucpIBO5_c9w
http://youtu.be/ucpIBO5_c9w
Fender 5e3p from Wurlitzer organ amp
Moderators: pompeiisneaks, Colossal
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Zombie_stomp
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Zombie_stomp
- Posts: 90
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Re: Fender 5e3p from Wurlitzer organ amp
New voltage chart.
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Zombie_stomp
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Re: Fender 5e3p from Wurlitzer organ amp
Also, Phil, the pins 4 of 6L6 tied together goes also to a terminal with two resistors to 2 separate capacitors, and another orange wire from that point to another capacitor.
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Zombie_stomp
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Re: Fender 5e3p from Wurlitzer organ amp
I went ahead and installed a guitar jack in the amp. I'm wondering what kind of design I might could build now that some new values have been determined. I also read about a feature that may be built into many organ amps as sort of a governor to keep them sounding clean. It said to go ahead and snip that out. With the old school circuit board, it might be difficult to track that bit down. Not sure what to do next. I must note that the 6L6s are getting a lot hotter in temperature than I think is normal. No red glow though, so that's good.
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Re: Fender 5e3p from Wurlitzer organ amp
Well, I think all of this is good news!
Regarding your perception of hot 6L6's, I submit you don't really know without measuring and I wouldn't be concerned if not red plating and voltages are reasonable.
In very round numbers, it seems your PT was probably 325-0-325 when built and line voltage was 110VAC. So, today you have 350-0-350. Let's go with the latter as a fact of life. IMO, this is good for just about any 2x 6L6 Fender type amp, and many other designs already out there. I think the world is your oyster on this one.
Since it is already running a pair of 6L6 and you've got an output transformer that works, I'd stick with 6L6's. I think both the 5B6 and the 5F6 (or 5F6a) are good possibilities given your early discussion of what you are seeking. Considering your level of experience is very basic, I'd urge you to consider the 5B6, which is a simpler build and I think will deliver satisfaction. I've built the 5B6, but there are others here with considerable experience on that circuit. If you just can't help yourself and want to build the 5F6(a), of course, that's up to you.
Another possibility is that like what you have. Clean it up, close it up and just roll with it.
Regarding your perception of hot 6L6's, I submit you don't really know without measuring and I wouldn't be concerned if not red plating and voltages are reasonable.
In very round numbers, it seems your PT was probably 325-0-325 when built and line voltage was 110VAC. So, today you have 350-0-350. Let's go with the latter as a fact of life. IMO, this is good for just about any 2x 6L6 Fender type amp, and many other designs already out there. I think the world is your oyster on this one.
Since it is already running a pair of 6L6 and you've got an output transformer that works, I'd stick with 6L6's. I think both the 5B6 and the 5F6 (or 5F6a) are good possibilities given your early discussion of what you are seeking. Considering your level of experience is very basic, I'd urge you to consider the 5B6, which is a simpler build and I think will deliver satisfaction. I've built the 5B6, but there are others here with considerable experience on that circuit. If you just can't help yourself and want to build the 5F6(a), of course, that's up to you.
Another possibility is that like what you have. Clean it up, close it up and just roll with it.
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Zombie_stomp
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Re: Fender 5e3p from Wurlitzer organ amp
It's way too quiet as it is. I'll have to build something louder. It sounds like it's putting out 2 watts. I want something slightly louder than my ampeg 15 watt.
Re: Fender 5e3p from Wurlitzer organ amp
I headed for a vacation for a while. I expect to see some progress when I return!
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Zombie_stomp
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Re: Fender 5e3p from Wurlitzer organ amp
Also, I'm not seeing the 5b6 on the weber site, do you know a source for the schematic, bill of materials, parts? They do show the 5F6a.
Re: Fender 5e3p from Wurlitzer organ amp
The Weber 5C3P kit is essentially the same as a 5b6.Zombie_stomp wrote:Also, I'm not seeing the 5b6 on the weber site, do you know a source for the schematic, bill of materials, parts? They do show the 5F6a.
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Zombie_stomp
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Re: Fender 5e3p from Wurlitzer organ amp
I hope you're gone for at least 2 weeks then Phil! Shipping times for parts and stuff. I'm glad it's a simple amp, I think it'll fit in this chassis.
Thanks for the tip, M. I'll have to get those printed out ASAP.
I was reading about a 5b6 build last night and he had some bass heaviness issues which cleared up when he changed the tone pot to a bass-roll off instead of a treble roll-off. Since this one is labeled 'proluxe' instead of bassman, perhaps it is modified to be that way already?
Oh hey, also important on my mind: can I just use a 5U4GB rectifier? I notice the 5c3p weber design calls for a WZ 34 recto.... But then again, the 5b6 used 5881s... I'll be looking it up in my spare time... Unless someone wants to chime in. EDIT: I am readin that they are interchangeable but the 5u4 lowers the plate voltage when used, which may be better for the way my PT runs right now.
I'm not sure where you found the layout, but I don't see the 5c3p on we Ed's site anymore. I'm sure I can find the part numbers for whatever I need in another amp's bill of materials.
Thanks for the tip, M. I'll have to get those printed out ASAP.
I was reading about a 5b6 build last night and he had some bass heaviness issues which cleared up when he changed the tone pot to a bass-roll off instead of a treble roll-off. Since this one is labeled 'proluxe' instead of bassman, perhaps it is modified to be that way already?
Oh hey, also important on my mind: can I just use a 5U4GB rectifier? I notice the 5c3p weber design calls for a WZ 34 recto.... But then again, the 5b6 used 5881s... I'll be looking it up in my spare time... Unless someone wants to chime in. EDIT: I am readin that they are interchangeable but the 5u4 lowers the plate voltage when used, which may be better for the way my PT runs right now.
I'm not sure where you found the layout, but I don't see the 5c3p on we Ed's site anymore. I'm sure I can find the part numbers for whatever I need in another amp's bill of materials.
Re: Fender 5e3p from Wurlitzer organ amp
https://taweber.powweb.com/store/kits_info_only.html
But I had these layouts and schematics from years ago on file.
The 5U4 lowers the voltage but is 3A and 5y3, 5V4 and 5AR4 are 2A so check with your PT to see if it handles 2A or 3A.
But I had these layouts and schematics from years ago on file.
The 5U4 lowers the voltage but is 3A and 5y3, 5V4 and 5AR4 are 2A so check with your PT to see if it handles 2A or 3A.
Re: Fender 5e3p from Wurlitzer organ amp
Info here:
https://taweber.powweb.com/store/5e3p_schem.jpg
https://taweber.powweb.com/store/5e3p_layout.jpg
Weber promotes itself and it's copper cap rectifier. Use whatever pleases you and if you don't know what pleases you, eeney meeny miney moe is as good a way of choosing as any other. Since you already have the tube, save a few dollars. 25 volts one way or the other isn't likely to matter much.
Really, I've said this before, on the 5881 vs 6L6, I'd urge you to move on. For purposes of this discussion they are fully equivalent as well as pinout compatible. The only meaningful difference is the 5881 has a lower maximum plate voltage that won't be at issue here. Read the tube spec sheets here for yourself and you'll see:
http://tubedata.itchurch.org/sheets/049/5/5881.pdf
http://tubedata.itchurch.org/sheets/049/6/6L6GC.pdf
If you are cramped for space in the chassis, you can omit one of the inputs. Besides, no one these days needs 4 input jacks. It is a waste of front panel space, more work, and more cost. Simplify it. The build is well documented and I think this is the thread: http://ampgarage.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=20213
IMO, you are not experienced enough to say if your build will be too bassy or not. I recommend you build something that is tested and that is known to work. If you aren't happy with the tone control at that point, you can always change it.
https://taweber.powweb.com/store/5e3p_schem.jpg
https://taweber.powweb.com/store/5e3p_layout.jpg
Weber promotes itself and it's copper cap rectifier. Use whatever pleases you and if you don't know what pleases you, eeney meeny miney moe is as good a way of choosing as any other. Since you already have the tube, save a few dollars. 25 volts one way or the other isn't likely to matter much.
Really, I've said this before, on the 5881 vs 6L6, I'd urge you to move on. For purposes of this discussion they are fully equivalent as well as pinout compatible. The only meaningful difference is the 5881 has a lower maximum plate voltage that won't be at issue here. Read the tube spec sheets here for yourself and you'll see:
http://tubedata.itchurch.org/sheets/049/5/5881.pdf
http://tubedata.itchurch.org/sheets/049/6/6L6GC.pdf
If you are cramped for space in the chassis, you can omit one of the inputs. Besides, no one these days needs 4 input jacks. It is a waste of front panel space, more work, and more cost. Simplify it. The build is well documented and I think this is the thread: http://ampgarage.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=20213
IMO, you are not experienced enough to say if your build will be too bassy or not. I recommend you build something that is tested and that is known to work. If you aren't happy with the tone control at that point, you can always change it.
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Zombie_stomp
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Re: Fender 5e3p from Wurlitzer organ amp
Oh yeah, I had moved on from the 5881s a long time ago. And now I've read that people are swapping out the two rectifiers in question, and also mentioning weber's recto. So that's a done deal. Now all I gotta do is get the parts and start building. I think.
Re: Fender 5e3p from Wurlitzer organ amp
Yup.Zombie_stomp wrote:Now all I gotta do is get the parts and start building.
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Zombie_stomp
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Re: Fender 5e3p from Wurlitzer organ amp
And it looks like I can save a lot of space on the board by cutting out 3 of the 4 inputs. And I can use just one 12ax7 as a result. I may cast my own fiberglass board. Or look for dielectric material online to make an eyelet board out of anyway. I have a slight need and other uses for an eyelet tool in my textile crafts so I might get one of those too.
One of you has posted the octal preamp layout and the other has posted the Noval preamp tube style. The latter SEEMS like the safer bet, but who knows? I think I also saw a 5b6 with an octal preamp tube and an octal phase splitter, which may be a third different design, but I may go simple and reliable and just use the layout Phil posted since I already have noval sockets and easy access to 12ax7s.
One of you has posted the octal preamp layout and the other has posted the Noval preamp tube style. The latter SEEMS like the safer bet, but who knows? I think I also saw a 5b6 with an octal preamp tube and an octal phase splitter, which may be a third different design, but I may go simple and reliable and just use the layout Phil posted since I already have noval sockets and easy access to 12ax7s.