Dirty Little Monster

mcrracer · Post by **mcrracer** » Tue Feb 24, 2009 2:10 pm

In the title description of this sub forum is an amp mentioned The Dirty Little Monster. I tried search and nothing came up. Does anyone know anything about this amp?

Reeltarded · Post by **Reeltarded** » Tue Feb 24, 2009 3:09 pm

Serach DLM and you will find some refs!

dartanion · Post by **dartanion** » Tue Feb 24, 2009 8:51 pm

From what most can gather is that there was/is maybe 2 or 3 of these that were ever built, and no one (save for the owners) knows where they would be?

By the description, it sounds like a high gain SE affair, but has yet to be confirmed.

wsaraceni · Post by **wsaraceni** » Tue Feb 24, 2009 9:14 pm

wreckboy owns one. search for his story on the komet modded thread.

here is his post about the DLM

Posted: Thu Oct 11, 2007 5:40 pm Post subject:
Trainwreck Experience #5

At some point after I got my Liverpool, Ken played the "original" Dirty Little Monster for me over the phone. As I remember, he mentioned the amp in his Trainwreck pages.
It was a little Fender (Champ?) that he totally "NUKED". Wow, what was that, he told me it's a amp called the Dirty Little Monster that he gave to his brother. The amp was in the shop for a little servicing. Raunchy Rock n Roll at it's finest. I believe he said that it was a rock n roll machine with no real clean sound, I didn't care, that amp sounded GREAT! I asked if his brother was interested in selling the amp, I'd like to be the 1st in line, he laughed and said that the amp was not for sale.
Later, he mentioned that he planning to design an amp for an nationally known amplifier company. This was after the Kendrick Climax (heartache) and before Komet got off the ground (story was an experience). He was calling it the Dirty Little Monster. It was designed to be a guitarist 1st real low powered true tube amp. I heard the Prototype DLM just after he built it. He told he had decided not to do the deal with the company and was planning to just keep the amp. I asked him that if he ever decided to sell the amp to give me the 1st call. As it was with my one of a kind Komet, he told that he wasn't going to sell the amp at this point, but agreed to give me the 1st call. And about a year later, he gave me the call. Interestingly, he sold the amp to me for the price of the parts. He was being a good friend and he knew I was a struggling musician. I ended up sending him twice the asking price. I know that he got lots of offers for that amp and could have made a fortune on a regular sale. But Ken was always true to his word.
INFO: Front Panel

Input
Gain
Treble
Bass
Master
Harmonics (Presence)
Slope (Midrange)
On Switch
Pilot Light

Back Panel

Power Cable
Fuse
Ext speaker
Main Speaker (8ohm)

2 ECC83 (GT Yugo)
1 EL 34 (Mullard xf2 )
1 GZ 34 (Mullard)

Single ended (EL34/6L6/6550) 8 to 10 watts
note: the original used a 6550
this Prototype sounded best with an EL34

The Prototype Dirty Little Monster that he built was very different from the Original. He described it as a Killer Plexi with Trainwreck clarity and voicing with the master disengaged. Using the master gave it a more JCM 800 flare. This Prototype wasn't as gained out as the Original. There was a trade off more tone and clarity less raw distortion. This would be a great recording amp and takes pedals really well (Menatone Blue Collar was killer combination). There is definite vintage plexi Marshall vibe to this amp. Great amp

mcrracer · Post by **mcrracer** » Tue Feb 24, 2009 10:22 pm

Thanks guys. I guess I have found pretty much all ther is on this one. Wreckboy seemed to have abruptly stopped posting before giving any real details or pix. What do you guys think??? Just a wreck front end on a SE back end? Anybody with extensive knowledge of TWs want to hazard a guess at any circuit values?

Zippy · Post by **Zippy** » Wed Feb 25, 2009 4:06 pm

mcrracer wrote:Thanks guys. I guess I have found pretty much all ther is on this one. Wreckboy seemed to have abruptly stopped posting before giving any real details or pix. What do you guys think??? Just a wreck front end on a SE back end? Anybody with extensive knowledge of TWs want to hazard a guess at any circuit values?

mcrracer wrote:"The Prototype Dirty Little Monster that he built was very different from the Original. He described it as a Killer Plexi with Trainwreck clarity and voicing with the master disengaged. Using the master gave it a more JCM 800 flare. This Prototype wasn't as gained out as the Original. There was a trade off more tone and clarity less raw distortion. This would be a great recording amp and takes pedals really well (Menatone Blue Collar was killer combination). There is definite vintage plexi Marshall vibe to this amp. Great amp"

Reading between the lines, I'd be more inclined to go along the morphology of the Rocket. Note the similarities to the Marshall Plexi and Fender 5F6-A (tweed Bassman) as well as the Vox AC-30.

Gain stage (perhaps two) - volume - gain stage - cathode follower - 3-knob tone stack - master volume with adjustable treble bleed - EL34.

Plexi tones come from using the 2.7k/0.68mF cathode bias on the first gain stage. Adjustable slope could be either switched or dialed in by putting a 50k pot in series with the 56k slope resistor in the tone stack (classic values tend to range from 56k to 100k in that position).

For output iron, I'd use a Fender Deluxe Reverb OT with the center tap lifted. If sourcing new SE iron, I'd go with iron rated at 15 watts or greater.

RJ Guitars · Post by **RJ Guitars** » Wed Feb 25, 2009 8:20 pm

Sounds like there might be a couple monsters out there... does that jive with what I'm reading? One had a ton of gain and the 2nd not so much? You don't suppose that maybe KF put the Express preamp in front of an SE output in one case and the Rocket preamp in front of an SE output in the 2nd case? That's a comment for pondering rather than any kind of declaration.

Look at the Express preamp and dig around and you'll find that it can built from a very slightly modified Princeton amp. Then look at the Rocket preamp and compare it to a 59' Bassman... same story. Point being that there really isn't much that is entirely new since RCA put out the tube handbook. You can probably make most amps ever produced by cutting and pasting a few major sections from a few old standards.

If you dig a little bit on the Blue Guitar web site, he scoured things down looking for info on the amp and you can read a few more pieces of history on it there. I asked him if there was more to it but he said he had run out of leads. I lead him to the Wreck boy pictures and he was pleased to see it. There might always be just a little something more that we can learn collectively.

From the wreckboy pictures it Looks like a standard size wreck chassis and all evidence points to a single ended high power amp. Looking at the tube compliment it would lead me to believe that Zippy's post has merit as well. With what I know in combination with the other reports I'd say a plexi front end into a single KT-88 would be a good starting spot... I would also agree that the EL34 came later.

rj

guitarsnguns04 · Post by **guitarsnguns04** » Wed Feb 25, 2009 10:32 pm

this has always interested me as well..good reads for sure!

sliberty · Post by **sliberty** » Thu Feb 26, 2009 1:37 am

This doesn't add anything really, but I found it interesting.

In an interview with KF, published in Dave Hunter's book, Ken says that Joe Walsh wanted a couple of DLM amps, and Dr. Z built them for him from the KF circuits. he goes on to say that Dr. Z was honorable because when he introduced his own single ended amp, it was a different circuit.

2tone · Post by **2tone** » Thu Feb 26, 2009 6:16 pm

Ken was doing a couple prototypes of the amp. Wreckboy got the first, and there were a couple output trannies left( different specs, but single ended and spec'd by Ken for the DLM) I was given one of the trannies, and the schematic. Another amp tech in Ca got the other and built a combo amp. Mine is a head. It is not a Rocket or Express front end. It is really a hot rodded JCM type circuit. I found that the trannie i got worked better with a 6550 tube instead of the EL 34.. Cool little amp, about 12 watts. great for lead work, not much clean region.

mcrracer · Post by **mcrracer** » Thu Feb 26, 2009 7:55 pm

2tone wrote:Ken was doing a couple prototypes of the amp. Wreckboy got the first, and there were a couple output trannies left( different specs, but single ended and spec'd by Ken for the DLM) I was given one of the trannies, and the schematic. Another amp tech in Ca got the other and built a combo amp. Mine is a head. It is not a Rocket or Express front end. It is really a hot rodded JCM type circuit. I found that the trannie i got worked better with a 6550 tube instead of the EL 34.. Cool little amp, about 12 watts. great for lead work, not much clean region.

Well finally , someone who has one. Thanks for writing and the info you have given. Is there any chance of any tech info? Pictures, schematic, anything to assist me in building one of these wonderful amps.

RJ Guitars · Post by **RJ Guitars** » Thu Feb 26, 2009 10:45 pm

2tone wrote:...It is not a Rocket or Express front end. It is really a hot rodded JCM type circuit. I found that the trannie i got worked better with a 6550 tube instead of the EL 34.. Cool little amp, about 12 watts. great for lead work, not much clean region.

You've got some great history there and I really enjoyed your story. Did you build yours on a standard Trainwreck chassis or go with your own chassis and layout?

As you might anticipate there is a great deal of interest in this amp. I had drawn up a schematic using both a Rocket front end and an Express front end but then Zippy had almost persuaded me to consider the Marshall plexi front end. That starts to look a whole lot like the Allen "Class Act" amp at some point which seems like a pretty good set of plans to follow and doesn't deviate from the direction you are pointing things.

Thanks for your help and I think all of us really enjoy learning the history and evolution of the Trainwreck story.

thanks,

rj

2tone · Post by **2tone** » Fri Feb 27, 2009 5:15 pm

I built it in a regular Trainwreck style chassis and put it in a curly maple Wreck head cab.. I think there would be a ton of variayions in the sound in an amp like this because of the transformer differences and small gain tweaks can change a lot. Another head was made with a Hammond SE trannie but was a little too bright and didn't break up quite right(too hi fi)..I had promised Ken not to give out the schematic, and would not feel right doing it even now. Even with the shcematic, the right output trannie would be harder to nail..

M Fowler · Post by **M Fowler** » Fri Feb 27, 2009 6:33 pm

Thanks to all of you for starting this tread on the DLM, it is just what I want to build as well.

Anyone with better skills than me, would you please draw up a JCM front end to SE and spec which trannies that I should used, RJ, Zippy anyone?

I would greatly be indebted to you.

Mark

mcrracer · Post by **mcrracer** » Fri Feb 27, 2009 6:38 pm

2tone wrote:I built it in a regular Trainwreck style chassis and put it in a curly maple Wreck head cab.. I think there would be a ton of variayions in the sound in an amp like this because of the transformer differences and small gain tweaks can change a lot. Another head was made with a Hammond SE trannie but was a little too bright and didn't break up quite right(too hi fi)..I had promised Ken not to give out the schematic, and would not feel right doing it even now. Even with the shcematic, the right output trannie would be harder to nail..

Thank you for the info you have given. I for one, wanted to see a schematic and or pictures not so much to copy or try to duplicate Ken's work, but to study it and try to understand how Ken thought. We all know none of us can really copy what Ken did. There are schematics readily available for the TW Express, Rocket and Liverpool, but who has built one that would pass KF's muster? No , many of us only want to try to understand the magic that was Ken's and ken's alone. Hiding the schematic away is cool if that is what you feel you must do, I for one will never ask again to see it. But there are only so many ways electronic components can be connected and the true point isn't to necessarily copy Ken anyway. The end we all are attempting to reach is that elusive "TONE" Not necessarily Ken's tone...but that "TONE". You know, the one we are all chasing. And the funny thing is my "TONE" aint necessarily your "TONR" and your "TONE" aint necessarily his "TONE"! We all may be chasing after something different!
Here, we all enjoy building amps, some famous circuits, some obscure things you may never have heard of. Many of even the famous ones heavily "borrowed" from other circuits anyway. I think it is a tribute to KF that so many of us respect his work. I am sure we all thank you for the info you have posted and we will continue our quest for that "TONE".

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