Upgrades to a Ceriatone "Rock It" kit?

[Paultergeist]

Greetings!

I will be building a Rocket-inspired amp -- using a Ceriatone "Rock It" kit as a starting point. I realize that there are varying opinions regarding the Ceriatone kits, but this is the kit I will soon have at my disposal (long story). Accepting the fact that the Ceriatone "Rock It" is the raw material I will be starting with, I wanted to get some opinions from others who may have some insights regarding logical changes or parts upgrades.

This will be my 7th complete tube amp build; but only my 2nd from a Ceriatone kit (first was the DC-30 clone). This kit is coming to me completely un-assembled (non-populated board).

Based on my previous experiences with the Ceriatone DC-30, my opinion was that the Ceriaton chassis, board, switches, pots, general hardware all seemed to be of very good quality.

The resistors seemed to be of standard good quality; I forgot how I felt about the signal caps (it has been a long time, and the amp has since been sold). I DO recall feeling a bit as though the filter caps (electrolytics) did not seem to be quite as robust as I might like, but the measured capacitance values all checked-out as okay. Upon completling the build, I eliminated some minor "ghost notes" by adding an up-stream Pi filter to the power rail -- but I never did diagnose the Ceriatone (brand) filter capacitors as being good or bad -- the question as to the quality of the filter caps kind of lingers in my mind........opinions?

I have read some not-so-flattering opinions regarding the Ceriatone OT -- has anyone really built a (stock) Ceriatone "Rock It" and THEN swapped OTs to compare for a sonic difference?

I notice that Ceriatone seems to like to incorporate a "half-power" switch into most of their 4 x EL84 circuits. This appears to be a deviation from the true "Wreck" circuits I have seen. Any concerns about keeping this feature?

My thanks in advance for any helpful opinions.

Paul

[dartanion]

Generally the Ceriatone kits are of decent quality. It's the way Nik does business that has riled folks, but I won't get into that.

Definitely upgrade the OT, but while you are at it, it makes sense to upgrade the PT and choke at the same time. I say this as I have built loads of Ceriatone kits for people over the years and what fails most are the transformers. I have had many bad PTs, thus the recommendation to do them both.

Other than the transformers, use whatever signal caps that you want for taste, and upgrade the filter caps if you see fit. Lots of good options out there for both.

[M Fowler]

The Ceriatone transformers don't look very good but they function.

I don't think the Ceriatone transformers sound as good as Heyboer, Pacific, Stancor, Dynaco or Edcor but I being opinionated here.

The rest of the components are good quality.

Mark

[dartanion]

One other note. The Ceriatone TW style chassis have the PT in a spot where it can be a problem with certain commercially available cabs. Anything with a back panel as the bell cover will not clear the cleat on that side. You can easily move the PT if needed, but I thought I would mention this as I ran into it a few years ago and had to have the cabinet design modified to clear the PT. If you use a wood cab like Ken's design, then it's not an issue.

[Paultergeist]

Thanks, all. I really appreciate the information.

As far as the PT clearance issues, I will probably -- *ahem* -- try to build a wooden head cabinet myself, but I plan on waiting until I have a fully functional amp chassis before I cross that bridge. That being the case, I'll have the chance to then take measurements and design for any space limitations. I do appreciate the heads-up, however.

Thanks again.

[yalesmith]

Nik at Ceriatone is a terrific guy and I have 2 of his amps and I cant say enough positive things. I will say this, order the amps with no transformers, first you will save a ton on shipping and then you can use what ever you like. I put MM in a AFD #35 and OD special,,,they both sound great. He will give you a great deal on the MM as well. Lastly, Nik has the option to use SOZO Caps as an upgrade.

Please elaborate on Nik and the way he does business... Curious to hear because I have not heard any negatives,

Thanks

[Paultergeist]

Actually, if I may be allowed -- as the originator of this thread -- to direct things a bit:

It is a very common observation that many of the more budget-minded amp kit manufacturers make some decisions which effect the quality of the components. I do not fault these suppliers and manufacturers for this -- were only the most "boutique" components used, the amp kit prices would skyrocket and we builders would probably never agree on all of the *best* components anyway. For me, part of the fun of building my amps is the personalization induced by some of the choices I make by way of parts swapping and component upgrades. That being said, my question is truly to ask: What have other builders found to be the most significant (tone-wise) component upgrades? I realize that I am asking for *opinions,* but I do value these opinions and weigh them in my own purchasing decisions. After all, who among us can afford to buy half a dozen OTs just to test them all and see which one we like best?

As for the specific vendor, I have only conducted two sales transactions with Ceriatone, but both transactions have been very positive and Nik has been helpful and responsive to my questions. I do not dispute, however, that there have been issues with builders other than myself, but I would really regret if this thread -- started by myself -- turned into a criticism of any vendor.

[Randy Magee]

Rather than getting hit with a big shipping bill, I'd deal with RJ here on the forum... a great guy and he supplies top notch components at very reasonable prices... not knocking Nik, just trying to support suppliers and contributors to the forum...

[Paultergeist]

Hey, thanks, Randy.

I have heard the name "RJ" mentioned a couple of times reading through thread posts within this forum -- always with extremely positive comments.
Is "RJ" his complete username on this forum, or are you aware of preferable contact information?

[Reeltarded]

RJGUITARS

http://ampgarage.com/forum/profile.php? ... ile&u=1709

[Big Jim]

rj has been involved in 2 Trainwreck type amps I've built so far....

The first was done as a "parts package", meaning everything needed was included.
The second was mostly just components, iron, and wire. My tool base, skill level, and building supplies increased in the interval between the two builds. Both amps are amazing. rj was prompt, informative, honest, and sold me quality parts at a fair price. I will continue to do business with rj from this point forward. Just my .02 worth.
By the way, he seems to sign his communications with "rj", not "RJ". Don't know why....

[Randy Magee]

Those new circuit board amps rj has going look pretty interesting too... my next build will probably be a Rocket... if and when I can convince my wife of the need of yet another amp... maybe I need to sell of some of the closet queens to make room for something new...

I too can't say enough good things about the guy... easy to work with, has a good product and good prices... that coupled with the knowledgeable, helpful guys on this forum pretty much makes a successful Wreck build a slam dunk... in my case, I missed the basket a few times, but it all turned out great!

[Paultergeist]

Hi guys,

Thanks for the continued informed dialog.

Having now several builds under my belt, I am by no means any sort of expert, but I have learned a few things along the way. Among the issues I have taken to heart, I try to build my amps in such a way that they can be serviced, components can be accessed as easily as possible. As opposed to all-out "breaking" of a component, I do find myself swapping things around a bit and playing with some resistor / capacitor values. In the case of this particular build, my plan is to FIRST use the stock (Ceriatone) iron, and THEN try different iron so thereafter. In particular, my previous building experiences have convinced me of the often dramatic impact of a more-refined (read: "boutique") OT over the typically budget-priced OTs often in the kits. I think you all have *sold* me on using RJ's iron for the upgrade.

While we are on the topic, I am curious what brand(s) of signal capacitors were typically used in the 'Wrecks -- Orange Drops? Mallories? (I might even try some SoZos in it -- but I am curious what KF might have used in the Rockets back in the day....?)

Thanks again to all for the helpful information.

Paul

[prspastor]

+1 for rj. Great business dealings with him. Very top quality components as well.