D'lite 44 BOM?

[lord preset]

OK, I've had a chance to strip the amp chassis down and measure voltages.

The PT secondaries are laid out as follows:

Brown
Black
Brown
Purple
Grey
Red
Orange
Green

And the unloaded voltages:

Brown-Black: 34.2
Brown-Brown 68.4
Purple-Grey: 6.8
Red-Orange: 182.3
Red-Green: 274.4

This seems to be consistent with Tonemerc's assessment. Now I need to understand how the Fuchs and/or Tonemerc's power supply schematics relate to the existing D'lite design.

The original layout has a separate rectifier board and power supply/filter board. From what I understand the provided schematics provide voltage doubling and rectification for the cathode and screen supplies but do they completely replace the filtering provided by the D'lite power board? The Tonemerc schematic would seem to (to me) but I am unclear on what the zener diodes are doing in the Fuchs design.

Also, re the bias supply, if I'm using the 32 volt secondary vs the 50 volt specified in the D'lite design does the rectifier section for the bias supply remain the same or does it need to change?

Finally, on the Tonemerc schematic what are the voltages/functions of B+1, B+2, B+3, B+4, B+5? If this is a common naming convention I apologize but I couldn't find it.

Thanks in advance for any advice offered.

[ToneMerc]

OK, I've had a chance to strip the amp chassis down and measure voltages.

The PT secondaries are laid out as follows:

Brown
Black
Brown
Purple
Grey
Red
Orange
Green

And the unloaded voltages:

Brown-Black: 34.2
Brown-Brown 68.4
Purple-Grey: 6.8
Red-Orange: 182.3
Red-Green: 274.4

This seems to be consistent with Tonemerc's assessment. Now I need to understand how the Fuchs and/or Tonemerc's power supply schematics relate to the existing D'lite design.

The original layout has a separate rectifier board and power supply/filter board. From what I understand the provided schematics provide voltage doubling and rectification for the cathode and screen supplies but do they completely replace the filtering provided by the D'lite power board? The Tonemerc schematic would seem to (to me) but I am unclear on what the zener diodes are doing in the Fuchs design.

Also, re the bias supply, if I'm using the 32 volt secondary vs the 50 volt specified in the D'lite design does the rectifier section for the bias supply remain the same or does it need to change?

Finally, on the Tonemerc schematic what are the voltages/functions of B+1, B+2, B+3, B+4, B+5? If this is a common naming convention I apologize but I couldn't find it.

Thanks in advance for any advice offered.

Red/Green will be your high tap =275 red= 275, green = 0?

Purple/Gray= 6.8VAC filaments

Brown/black= 34V bias supply, you only need a range of 19-28 neg volts, shoot for 22-24 bias for starters.

Fuchs zeners: instead of a huge power resistor, the zener diodes are used to pull down preamp rail voltage.

BN power board: cannot be used as configured

BN rectifier board: cannot work as configured, however it can be easily wired as a doubler.

BN Bias: 3W 600-650R power resistor, use 150 or 220uf 50/63V cap

TM

[lord preset]

Red/Green will be your high tap =275 red= 275, green = 0?

Purple/Gray= 6.8VAC filaments

Brown/black= 34V bias supply, you only need a range of 19-28 neg volts, shoot for 22-24 bias for starters.

Fuchs zeners: instead of a huge power resistor, the zener diodes are used to pull down preamp rail voltage.

BN power board: cannot be used as configured

BN rectifier board: cannot work as configured, however it can be easily wired as a doubler.

BN Bias: 3W 600-650R power resistor, use 150 or 220uf 50/63V cap

TM

OK, so if I will to go with the approach shown in the "HIGH_VOLTAGE_PS_V2.jpg" schematic, would this schematic as written work for my PT? The Fuchs diagram assumes I would know how to adapt the BN power board, which I don't. I'm reading as fast as I can but I'm not at that level Comparing the "HIGH_VOLTAGE_PS_V2.jpg" schematic to the original BN power supply schematic (attached) it seems like it replicates the functions of the original design minus the bias supply and with the addition of voltage doubling. So I think I could manage laying it out IF the component values are appropriate and it yields the right voltages.

And a last puzzler for me. How does 275 volts unloaded yield 775 volts unloaded? I thought that voltage doublers, well, doubled. Thanks.

[ToneMerc]

OK, so if I will to go with the approach shown in the "HIGH_VOLTAGE_PS_V2.jpg" schematic, would this schematic as written work

And a last puzzler for me. How does 275 volts unloaded yield 775 volts unloaded? I thought that voltage doublers, well, doubled. Thanks.

Again, that BN main power board as laid out will not work for either doubler scheme. Discard that BN D'lite power supply schematic totally for now.

I'm not familar with your amp, but it appears to be a MM style power supply clone, so the concept is exactly the same. Thus, it appears that your transformer could be adapted to either "doubler" supply scheme.
These circuits are not cookie cutter, so there will be some voltage rail tweaking involved, thus the bleeders.

Concerning PS V2, I've never build that exact circuit, as I prefer to do it the way Dumble does it. So try a 10W 43K and 750K 2W bleeder and then hang the 150K off the last node (V1) to simulate the FET circuit loading.

1.41 * 2(double) = 2.82, thus 2.82 * 275 = 775.6

FWIW, this scheme is not hard, but could be terribly lethal and I don't recommended it for a beginner.


TM

[lord preset]

I do get that the BN power board will not work. I was asking whether implementing the High Voltage v2 schematic instead of the BN design would work. What I am getting from your answer is that it would need to be tweaked for it to work with the PT I have. And in that regard I probably am in over my head. I am confident in my ability follow a layout and to not to electrocute myself but I'm just not at the level were I would feel confident tweaking a high voltage power supply design.

So I will still do the Dlite 44 but I may source a PT/OT combo that matches the BN design and save the KMD transformers for a later build. thanks again for your help.

OK, so if I will to go with the approach shown in the "HIGH_VOLTAGE_PS_V2.jpg" schematic, would this schematic as written work

And a last puzzler for me. How does 275 volts unloaded yield 775 volts unloaded? I thought that voltage doublers, well, doubled. Thanks.

Again, that BN main power board as laid out will not work for either doubler scheme. Discard that BN D'lite power supply schematic totally for now.

I'm not familar with your amp, but it appears to be a MM style power supply clone, so the concept is exactly the same. Thus, it appears that your transformer could be adapted to either "doubler" supply scheme.
These circuits are not cookie cutter, so there will be some voltage rail tweaking involved, thus the bleeders.

Concerning PS V2, I've never build that exact circuit, as I prefer to do it the way Dumble does it. So try a 10W 43K and 750K 2W bleeder and then hang the 150K off the last node (V1) to simulate the FET circuit loading.

1.41 * 2(double) = 2.82, thus 2.82 * 275 = 775.6

FWIW, this scheme is not hard, but could be terribly lethal and I don't recommended it for a beginner.


TM

[lord preset]

So as far as "standard" PT and OT choices go, any issues with these?

PT: http://www.classictone.net/40-18005.pdf

OT: http://www.classictone.net/40-18001.pdf

The PT has a 50v bias supply like the Dlite spec. No 5v for relays but I am not going to do the relays, at least intitially.

The OT has 4/8/16 taps. No option for 6V6 vs 6L6 but I am building this as a Dlite 44 anyway.

[ToneMerc]

So as far as "standard" PT and OT choices go, any issues with these?

PT: http://www.classictone.net/40-18005.pdf

OT: http://www.classictone.net/40-18001.pdf

The PT has a 50v bias supply like the Dlite spec. No 5v for relays but I am not going to do the relays, at least intitially.

The OT has 4/8/16 taps. No option for 6V6 vs 6L6 but I am building this as a Dlite 44 anyway.

You can always use those and could build a quad 6V6 amp as well. You may regret not initially installing a clean/od or pab relay.

TM

[martin manning]

The OT has 4/8/16 taps. No option for 6V6 vs 6L6 but I am building this as a Dlite 44 anyway.

You can run 6V6's if you miss-match the speaker (4 ohm tap into 8 ohm load), provided you have enough range in the bias adjustment.

[lord preset]

So as far as "standard" PT and OT choices go, any issues with these?

PT: http://www.classictone.net/40-18005.pdf

OT: http://www.classictone.net/40-18001.pdf

The PT has a 50v bias supply like the Dlite spec. No 5v for relays but I am not going to do the relays, at least intitially.

The OT has 4/8/16 taps. No option for 6V6 vs 6L6 but I am building this as a Dlite 44 anyway.

You can always use those and could build a quad 6V6 amp as well. You may regret not initially installing a clean/od or pab relay.

TM

You may be right. But it looks like there are ways to run the relays off the 6.3v filament tap if I go that route. 6.3 volts scare me less than 700

[lord preset]

The OT has 4/8/16 taps. No option for 6V6 vs 6L6 but I am building this as a Dlite 44 anyway.

You can run 6V6's if you miss-match the speaker (4 ohm tap into 8 ohm load), provided you have enough range in the bias adjustment.

Thanks, but for whatever reason I have had trouble getting along with 6V6 amps over the years Maybe a quartet would be different, but I'm inclined to stick with the 6L6 pair.

[martin manning]

Well, you brought it up...

[M Fowler]

Looks like you found out that the donor amp wasn't that good a choice for this build but could make a fire breathing 80w KT88 amp.

If your building a head I would use the 50w MC OT with 4/8/16 secondaries.

For a combo you can go with your choice since MC makes the Bassman OT in 2 or 4 or 8 ohms your choice. The Super reverb OT is 2 ohms.

Yes going 50w 6L6gc will give you the 5vac tap for relay, but a small 6v transformer is cheap if you want to go for a 100 watt version instead.

[lord preset]

Some progress. The chassis is modded for IEC power, 12ax7s etc. PT and OT ordered, main and power eyelet boards are done.

One dummy question - in the Tweaked D'lite layout are labeled 150K, 220K but are drawn to resemble Orange Drops. What are these - capacitors or resistors? If they are resistors what type/brand would they be? Looking at build photos they appear to be a different color than Orange Drops but are not anything I recognize.

Thanks.

[Synchu]

Resistors, Dale (now Vishay/Dale) brand, metal film.

[M Fowler]

Those are the plate resistors of V1 1% Dale RN65 resistors.