Best beginning professional's amp?

[skyboltone]

Ok, I'm sitting here in the hotel in Vancouver Washington having delivered the two hole Liverpool to my 14 year old nephew. I never did do a wattage calc but my guess is somewhere around 15 watts at the 324 plate voltage and 10.9 on the cathodes. When I was tweaking it I used a 4 10s cab filled with eminence 1058's and the amp would definitely hurt you. As delivered I made him an open back 1 12 with a warehouse speakers Veteran. Not quite so loud or bright of course.

He's 14 and definitely has better control of the amp than I do because he plays so much cleaner. He's so happy he's peeing hisself. He don't shred, he plays. Anyway here's the deal. I think he needs a 4 12 cab and I told his parents and Grandparents that a Carvin filled with their Brit speakers would probably fill the bill.

Or where can I find a plan for a 1960 slant cab?

The other thing I have in mind is to make him a single channel Marshall Lead 50 type of thing. I got some iron for one but he's gonna be limited to 4 ohms output for 4400 primary or 8 ohms output for 8800 primary. That tranny's out of a 5791A powered Leslie cabinet.

Or I could just get uncheap and buy some dang new metal for him and be done with it.

Anyway, he's running EMGs in a very nicely set up Epi LP and I told his dad to reach down and get him a set of Duncans or Classic 57s for crying out loud. This kid really does have the potential to make it and I wanna be there for him as much as possible.

What would you build him as a larger venue amp?

Dan H

[Johnhenry]

Sky, There's a guy on Ebay got a nice 2X12 or 4X12 cab kit, Marshall style for 99 buck's, look's interesting to me,
Johnhenry
chk out item # 290204405638

[Structo]

18watt.com has the plans for a 1960 4x12 slant cab.

[CaseyJones]

Carvin is right there on the West Coast. Those Legacy cabs are already built and they're a pretty cool piece.

18 watts cranked should be enough. If it isn't just hook the kid up with an Express.

[paulster]

Dan

I'd definitely go the 4x12 route. If he needs more after that then maybe an Express, or just mic the baby Liverpool as they'll have to have a decent PA to get the singer heard over it anyway.

If he's gotten used to controlling one of these amps then it would almost seem like a retrograde step to get something that doesn't have the same touch-sensitivity.

The plans from 18watt.com are also dimensioned for a Marshall 4x10 if that's of interest from a space perspective.

Paul

[CaseyJones]

Sky, There's a guy on Ebay got a nice 2X12 or 4X12 cab kit, Marshall style for 99 buck's, look's interesting to me,
Johnhenry
chk out item # 290204405638

Yeah, I checked. Factor in the cost of an emergency room visit to remove the splinters.

It continues to amaze me... when it comes to bottomfeeders you just can't go low enough.

How 'bout a nice Behringer cabinet? They come already loaded with speakers.

http://www.google.com/products?hl=en&re ... 1&ie=UTF-8

And yeah, I'm kidding. I learned the hard way... you can have the best amp on earth, plug it into a cheap cabinet with junk speakers then swap tubes, capacitors and the pickups on your guitar tryin' to make it right. Your signal chain is only as good as its weakest link. Buy the good stuff and cry ONCE.

Hey Dan, that 4 x 10" you built is a solid piece of gear... why not build a 2 x 12" like it? Pick up a couple second hand Celestions on eBay. Just 'cuz the kid is 14 doesn't mean he needs to drag around a 4 x 12". Come to think of it how does a 14 year old move a 4 x 12", screw it to his skateboard?!

[keithrick]

Dan,

You are freakin cool Uncle! I am sure your nephew would be happy however you decided to proceed with cab.

I can just imagine the look on his face when he cranked that 'Pool up!

keith

[skyboltone]

Thanks Guys for your thinking on this:
Tom, like has been pointed out the 4 12 Marshall might be just a tad heavy the way I see it. I make my Leo cabs out of pine and they are amazingly light. I may do what Casey suggested and either scale up the 4 10 cab or build a 2 12 open back like it. When I was running around in a band full of 14-16 year olds we always had somebodies dad with a station wagon. 9 gigs out of 10 were in a cafeteria and the other was in a Gym. In those days I played a bandmaster and our lead guy used a twin. He's still got the twin AND the 64 burst strat. He was the smart one.

You should have seen the look on his mother's face when we cranked it up! What the heck. She'll either get used to it or jump off of something tall. My folks had amazing resilience back in those days and I couldn't actually play higher than the cowboy chords anyway. Except for Louie Louie.

I'll put together something out of the Leslie iron for myself and when he gets to where he's just not making it on 18 watts we'll think about where to go from there. Paulster's point about touch sensitivity was right on. I'm amazed at how well this kid realizes he has to develop his own tone. Amazing.

[benoit]

If he digs the two-hole liverpool why not build one full out 4xEL84?

[CaseyJones]

Thanks Guys for your thinking on this:
Tom, like has been pointed out the 4 12 Marshall might be just a tad heavy the way I see it. I make my Leo cabs out of pine and they are amazingly light. I may do what Casey suggested and either scale up the 4 10 cab or build a 2 12 open back like it.

The 2 x 12" can go two ways... 26 1/2" wide x 19" tall x around 10 1/2" deep gives you a cab the size of a Fender Twin. It's large but not nearly a handful like a 4 x 12".

If you want to cop some of that boxy 4 x 12" vibe build the box 24" by 24". Did you build your 4 x 10" that big or is it just a little smaller? 2 x 12" will just fit diagonally in a 24" by 24" cabinet.

When I was running around in a band full of 14-16 year olds we always had somebodies dad with a station wagon. 9 gigs out of 10 were in a cafeteria and the other was in a Gym.

Those were different times. There's a lot of mini-vans out there and not many station wagons. If gas keeps goin' up and up we'll all be drivin' itty bitty two seaters. Maybe I'll take Twang's advice and buy a BMW... an old Isetta! Suburu 360s are cool too but either way a late model Civic is safer, more economical and more reliable. In any case these days I choose my gear considering that I'll probably need to haul it in a compact car. Good thing I'm not a drummer!

"Smart" 14 year olds: They tell me that you're born with all the brain and nerve cells you'll ever get. Between the booze, the drugs and the head injuries many of us have, umm, a few less brain cells that we started out with.

Kids are pretty much designed to absorb information, many of them if they're not stuck in some video game are capable of amazing things. By 18 or 19 years old they know all there is to know, just ask a 19 year old! We should change the Constitution so we can elect teenagers for President, then float 'em out on an iceberg when they hit 23!

Aw heck, where would that leave me, then?!

[benoit]

a late model Civic is safer, more economical and more reliable.

Amen, I got my '03 pretty young at 50k. She runs like a song and gets 39-40 highway, just under 30 city.

[CaseyJones]

a late model Civic is safer, more economical and more reliable.

Amen, I got my '03 pretty young at 50k. She runs like a song and gets 39-40 highway, just under 30 city.

Off-topic but run synthetic oil in it if you aren't already. You'll get 200k out of that car easy and get better mileage with synthetic. If you can't stand the six bucks a quart consider that you can get away with a 10k change interval, Amsoil suggests 20k with a filter change at 10k.

[benoit]

a late model Civic is safer, more economical and more reliable.

Amen, I got my '03 pretty young at 50k. She runs like a song and gets 39-40 highway, just under 30 city.

Off-topic but run synthetic oil in it if you aren't already. You'll get 200k out of that car easy and get better mileage with synthetic. If you can't stand the six bucks a quart consider that you can get away with a 10k change interval, Amsoil suggests 20k with a filter change at 10k.

Thanks for the tip, I'm about due for a change anyway.

[skyboltone]

[
The 2 x 12" can go two ways... 26 1/2" wide x 19" tall x around 10 1/2" deep gives you a cab the size of a Fender Twin. It's large but not nearly a handful like a 4 x 12".

If you want to cop some of that boxy 4 x 12" vibe build the box 24" by 24". Did you build your 4 x 10" that big or is it just a little smaller? 2 x 12" will just fit diagonally in a 24" by 24" cabinet.

This one. My 1 12" is 20 X 21.5. Same construction but with oval port.
[IMG1272]http://i32.tinypic.com/2hcq9fq.gif[/img]

[CaseyJones]

Ah, the old Dueltone 5F6.

I wondered about that one because as near as I can tell an original tweed Bassman is 23" wide by 22 1/2" tall. Dueltone has the control panel cutout at 17 1/4", you'd find that if you built it as a tweed amp rather than a speaker cabinet one of the inputs would be mighty cramped if not partially obscured.

If you had to do it again 23 1/2" x 23 1/2" is better or go the extra 1/2" and round it up to 24". You're cutting up 1 x 12" which is actually 3/4" x 11 1/4" so why not go the full 11 1/4" deep? While we're talkin' boards good luck findin' 1 x 10" that's actually 9 1/4" or even 9 1/8". I got a Home Depot gift card so I went over there and bought a few boards just to use it up. Their 1 x 10" is 9" wide.

Not dissin' your original 4 x 10" though. Anything in that ballpark size-wise is gonna be a rippin' cab.