Most versatile D-style amp with Reverb and FX loop?

[VintageCharlie]

Hi folks,

sorry for the long post, most relevant part is marked in bold.

I have decided to acquire some sort of Dumble clone or Dumble inspired amp in near future. Due to the high expense of these amps and potential losses on resale (in case of clones) i would really want to do my best in order to get the right amp for me. I've done my best researching and listening to clips, but the variations on the Dumble theme are sheer overwhelming to someone new to this type of amp. Also i am located in Europe and the closest dealer that has a few Dumble style amps in stock is about 1500 KM away from me, therefore i unfortunately cannot just test and compare, which would be the most sensible solution (might make a special trip to Netherlands for that at some point though).

From recordings it seems to me like i really like the ODS sound, in particular the overdrive "channel", thick and smooth like nothing else i've heard. I see there are variants in tone stacks and additional tone stacks, but from recordings alone it is very hard to judge what actual difference they make. Therefore i can attempt to describe what i would be after for my purpose in hopes that some of the great and experienced builders over here can share their view on this.

What i am after is a "versatile" amp, meaning:
- it is musical and usable in just about any music genre while going from sparkly clean to edge of breakup up until drive and almost hi-gain
- good pedal platform (at least in the clean "channel")
- the amp is capable of a nice clean op with the guitars volume - without loosing clarity and definition and without getting too much quieter than with full volume
- sounds great with any guitar (talking vintage style strat and les paul pickups here mainly), not much readjustment to EQ/settings needed when changing guitars
- wide tonal range and effective EQ making it possible to approximate many amp sounds ranging from fendery / marshally / voxy type of tones
- onboard reverb and buffered series FX loop

I would be prepared to buy new, if used ones do not come up in Europe, but would also consider building my own. But the thing is, before attempting a build and investing time and money - i need a reference of a good one anyway, so i'd have something to compare to. What i have been considering so far:

- ODS with built in dumbleator and one or two tube reverb - is there such a thing, does it make sense? I am asking this because i feel like i prefer the overdrive of the ODS circuit more than most other variations
- Amplified Nation Wonderland
- Welagen ODR
- Two Rock Bloomfield drive (great cleans, not sure about the overdrive, seems a bit thin compared to ODS (at least from the clips that i had the chance to listen to)

i've owned quite a few vintage amps (mainly british amps, but also a BF Super Reverb) and while i love the tones each of them has, what has always bothered me is that they tend to get harsh in a live setting (in small rooms - not such an issue in arenas i am sure), while the Dumble inspired designs seem to sound in the room almost like these amps well recorded, so this tone has me quite captured now.

Thank you very much in advance for your input!

VintageCharlie

[j0k3335]

being in Europe too, I understand your situation ! : not easy to try a "Dumble-like" !

Some two-rocks ... but they are, here, expensive .

" ODS with built in dumbleator and one or two tube reverb - is there such a thing, does it make sense?" ==

It makes sense to me to NOT have to had then the cost of a "Dumbulator", then a reverb. And most of the time I like to use a bit of reverb and a bit of delay .

So I finally choose a Fuchs ODS which has these 2 options and I'm enough satisfied.

I've tried a Ceriatone BluesMaster : funny, but a little bit "wild and raw" for my low volume playing in my home studio ! ... and I had to buy their Kleinulator, a reverb ...

A chance, I still have my Fuchs ODS 30 ... and finally buy a second one : a Fuchs Triple Drive.
A good amp, just a litlle bit disapointed that the third channel ( the clean one's ) is not "fender Blackface" enough .

Concerning pedals : some are welcome, some ( probably develop on Fender clean platform ) are a little bit less efficient ( I can compare with my Fender Concert II ).

Concerning prices : you can get some used one's at really decent prices ( really less than Two Rock, Carol Ann, ... ... : really too expensive here == too bad ! ).

Good luck in your journey ...

[lovetone]

There is this in the U.K.

http://www.voltamps.co.uk/amplifier-ser ... er-rr.html

[JD0x0]

Fuchs TDS maybe. I think Andy has Euro distributors now.

[pamaz67]

I have built professionally amps and among them A lot of D clones and inspired amps.
Now I don't do it professionally, but just as a Hobby. I own a few d styled amps, made by myself, and heavily modified Fuchs ods ( just the badge name is standard) that IMO is the best amplifier that I, and a few fellows guitar enthusiasts have ever played.
And I live in Italy ( The weirdest European country, for many aspects).
If I were you, I would give a look at the Kingsley amplifiers. They are nothing less than outstanding.
They are made in the UK, and the guy seems to be very friendly and knowledgeable.
Give a look at them. They are worth attention.

EDIT: just to clarify. I don' have any connection with Kingsley, nor I don't know the man personally. Is just that a friend owns a couple amps and stompboxes, and i can say that all of them are excellent stuff.

[j0k3335]

...
If I were you, I would give a look at the Kingsley amplifiers. ...

except that (from Kingsley site) "We are currently very back ordered for amplifiers and cabinets and as such we are not taking downpayments for these items at the moment. The list is about 4 years long" ...

Faster to ask Howard/Alexander ?

just kidding ( anyway it could be a good idea, second hand ).

[pdf64]

And they seem to be in Canada now, rather than the UK
http://kingsleyamplifiers.com/about/30/

[pamaz67]

I didn't know he moved to Canada. Nice place to live. I can understand him.....

[VintageCharlie]

Fuchs TDS maybe. I think Andy has Euro distributors now.

Thanks! An interesting model, but probably not very practical due to size. Ticks the versatility box for sure though.

There is this in the U.K.

http://www.voltamps.co.uk/amplifier-ser ... er-rr.html

Thanks for the hint! Was not aware of them. Price wise it is up there with the better known US brands, but looks like a good option too.

I have built professionally amps and among them A lot of D clones and inspired amps.
Now I don't do it professionally, but just as a Hobby. I own a few d styled amps, made by myself, and heavily modified Fuchs ods ( just the badge name is standard) that IMO is the best amplifier that I, and a few fellows guitar enthusiasts have ever played.
And I live in Italy ( The weirdest European country, for many aspects).
If I were you, I would give a look at the Kingsley amplifiers. They are nothing less than outstanding.
They are made in the UK, and the guy seems to be very friendly and knowledgeable.
Give a look at them. They are worth attention.

EDIT: just to clarify. I don' have any connection with Kingsley, nor I don't know the man personally. Is just that a friend owns a couple amps and stompboxes, and i can say that all of them are excellent stuff.

Would the modified Fuchs ODS be an amp that works well with Strat AND Les Paul clean and dirty tones? Can you elaborate on the direction the mods went into - any specific Dumble amp or mod? (if it is not a secret of course)

Btw. i know Kingsley through their pedals - i have a couple and am again on the waitlist for another bunch of them. That stuff is indeed top notch and i completely understand why there is such a long list and hype surrounding them.
4 years wait list for the amps - didn't know it was that long.

[VintageCharlie]

being in Europe too, I understand your situation ! : not easy to try a "Dumble-like" !

Some two-rocks ... but they are, here, expensive .

" ODS with built in dumbleator and one or two tube reverb - is there such a thing, does it make sense?" ==

It makes sense to me to NOT have to had then the cost of a "Dumbulator", then a reverb. And most of the time I like to use a bit of reverb and a bit of delay .

So I finally choose a Fuchs ODS which has these 2 options and I'm enough satisfied.

I've tried a Ceriatone BluesMaster : funny, but a little bit "wild and raw" for my low volume playing in my home studio ! ... and I had to buy their Kleinulator, a reverb ...

A chance, I still have my Fuchs ODS 30 ... and finally buy a second one : a Fuchs Triple Drive.
A good amp, just a litlle bit disapointed that the third channel ( the clean one's ) is not "fender Blackface" enough .

Concerning pedals : some are welcome, some ( probably develop on Fender clean platform ) are a little bit less efficient ( I can compare with my Fender Concert II ).

Concerning prices : you can get some used one's at really decent prices ( really less than Two Rock, Carol Ann, ... ... : really too expensive here == too bad ! ).

Good luck in your journey ...

Thanks for sharing your experiences! Looks like Fuchs is a viable option in Europe.

[VintageCharlie]

I found that Sergio from Italy (Clover amps), who is also a regular on this forum, builds very nice Dumble style amps. They look top notch build wise and the sounds seem to be very authentic to my ear. Good recordings and great playing helps conveying the tones.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ti57VyBddpc
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rhNdY37aZlo
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6S5jSznruG4&t=9s
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vg95ocaDmxM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MPt1KEQctWA
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EzVWH84nWAk
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=In5r9URX5KY
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2TZergfblHg

Price-wise his builds are below the Fuchs and he can build a HRM or non HRM or a specific serial nr. Dumble type amp with an integrated dumbleator.

I in particular like the HRM blues master (first clip from this list), but of course it is difficult to differentiate, if it is due to the player, amp settings, recording setup, etc. But what i hear in comparison to the other clips - it has all the same nice fluid drive characteristics of the ODS, but with more "bite" and a bit more definition (less mids i guess), but seems to work well with the overdrive tones. This might be the right amp, but again, would be interesting to hear clean and drive with single coils and humbuckers to see the whole spectrum.

I guess what i am looking for is an amp that can bridge the clean tones a la Two Rock Classic Reverb Signature / Bloomfield drive / Amplified nation Wonderland, etc. and the hallmark ODS overdrive sounds. The first (blackface type sounding category has the nicest strat sounds, but at least judging from clips, it has a thinner drive sound (which seems logical, as clean and drive channels are cascaded). To really nail that an amp with two clean channels (black face and ods style) would be needed. I guess that is the approach of the Fuchs tripple drive?

I am wondering if the HRM version might approach just that sweet spot of a more black face type clean and classic ODS overdrive?

[lovetone]

I found these for Volt Amps from back in 2010 from the Nearly Dan tribute Band.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QxYrc5N9rBI

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sWZQKC4OjOo