Silkscreen vs faceplates
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- RJ Guitars
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Re: Silkscreen vs faceplates
Powder coating is very cool stuff - tough as nails and a smooth consistent finish that covers a multitude of finish blems. Silk screening also gives a chassis that boost of professionalism that makes a diy home project look every bit as good as anything you can buy at Guitar Center. The thin front panel depth, the economy of buying multiple units - whats not to like?
I tried to do this as well as a handful of other methods with both chassis and faceplates for the TrainWreck amps and what I found is that the standard just can't seem to be defined for the customer base. Everybody always seems to want "a little more of this" or "move that" or "I want my name" or "I don't want your name" on it, etc..
So suppose you can nail down the perfect chassis then you've got the golden goose... but not for long. If it's really better, faster, cheaper - then Ceriatone, Triode Electronics, Watts Audio, rj guitars, etc - they are all interested in those same customers... not to mention the entire nation of China where they are extremely technology and market savvy.
The diy amp world is really a pretty small group so the trick is to keep the offering small enough that the competition doesn't go after it yet big enough to make it worth your while...
I tried to do this as well as a handful of other methods with both chassis and faceplates for the TrainWreck amps and what I found is that the standard just can't seem to be defined for the customer base. Everybody always seems to want "a little more of this" or "move that" or "I want my name" or "I don't want your name" on it, etc..
So suppose you can nail down the perfect chassis then you've got the golden goose... but not for long. If it's really better, faster, cheaper - then Ceriatone, Triode Electronics, Watts Audio, rj guitars, etc - they are all interested in those same customers... not to mention the entire nation of China where they are extremely technology and market savvy.
The diy amp world is really a pretty small group so the trick is to keep the offering small enough that the competition doesn't go after it yet big enough to make it worth your while...
- dorrisant
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Re: Silkscreen vs faceplates
I have a CNC and I am looking for a laser head... What kind of output would be needed for etching/engraving.
I acid etch most of what I need right now but man it takes a while... Last plates I did were for an ODS. I could buy them from amplates.com for about $275 with all of the fees or make them in about five hours... Either way is too expensive too keep doing.
Powder coat seems easy enough and there are tons of cool colors. What I want to know is what ink to use... I could make a jig to silk screen them.
I acid etch most of what I need right now but man it takes a while... Last plates I did were for an ODS. I could buy them from amplates.com for about $275 with all of the fees or make them in about five hours... Either way is too expensive too keep doing.
Powder coat seems easy enough and there are tons of cool colors. What I want to know is what ink to use... I could make a jig to silk screen them.
"Education is what you're left with after you have forgotten what you have learned" - Enzo
- RJ Guitars
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Re: Silkscreen vs faceplates
I've found there are two kinds of lasers for this task... I forget the designation but the bottom line is that one will make nice letters by burning through or oxidizing metal painted or anodized surfaces. There is a 2nd more powerful (or different type) that will burn images in wood or actually cut holes. The local shop I use offered me a pristine used one for $5K once (laser etching machine not just a head), so I would have needed a lot of business to recover that... I passed on it though.dorrisant wrote:I have a CNC and I am looking for a laser head... What kind of output would be needed for etching/engraving...
Powder coat seems easy enough and there are tons of cool colors. What I want to know is what ink to use... I could make a jig to silk screen them.
By the way, an anodized faceplate with a laser etched pattern will stand up to brutal treatment, the images don't tend to fade and you can't smear them. I have found that they are a little dull so you need to clear coat them once you get them right... the clear coat can scratch easily though.
I did have powder coated chassis laser etched once - she missed the mark on alignment and I used a faceplate to cover up the botch. Her story was that the chassis were not perfect. Good question - how perfect can you get a formed chassis? Pretty darn close is my experience but the accumulation of errors is part of the formula for the project - the chassis has to be right and the etching machine has to be right... or is that you have to work with people who are really on the ball?
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- RJ Guitars
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Re: Silkscreen vs faceplates
You could also use the small ball end mill to cut the patterns directly into the plate (or chassis). This is very cool stuff but it requires super flat/stiff surfaces and is pretty machine shop intensive... but cool!dorrisant wrote:I have a CNC....
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Re: Silkscreen vs faceplates
Whatever else you don't like about them, Thomas Organ had a decent way of making the panels pretty. They used 0.020" aluminum sheet painted the (black) background color, then silkscreened. That offers a pretty decent middle ground. Thin aluminum panels can be powder coated easily and cheaply, and likewise silkscreened easily. The aluminum can have most of the processes you can think of done to it, and it can then be put onto the panel without blowing you out of standard pots. It can even be glued down with contact cement if you're worried about edge bending. This trick separates the appearance work from the chassis forming work.
Of course, Thomas used panels with 90 degree bends in them and silkscreen on both faces. I tried to get local custom silkscreen shops to do this, and they all passed.
Of course, Thomas used panels with 90 degree bends in them and silkscreen on both faces. I tried to get local custom silkscreen shops to do this, and they all passed.
Re: Silkscreen vs faceplates
Have you also looked into Cerakote? It's the ceramic coating that is sprayed on and cured in an oven that is mostly used as a gun coating. It is thinner than powder and supposed to be far more durable and I don't think a personal setup would be to costly.
Re: Silkscreen vs faceplates
I have been using these guys: http://www.engravers.com/photo-sensitive-metal. So far no fading and I haven't had a scratching problem (Yet). Not cheap, but much less than the chassis' I have build. For prototypes and some custom work I have used spray paint, waterslide decals and clear-coat. Still looking for a good powder-coat / silkscreen shop that is both local and acceptable.
Ryan Brown
Brown Amplification LLC
Brown Amplification LLC
Re: Silkscreen vs faceplates
CK like many coatings is only as good as the prep one puts into it and CK is very sensitive to a quality finish prep and pre finish handling. It really requires a paint booth setup to get the most out of it. While it is more durable than some other finishes, it certainly is not scratch resistant as its only about .001 thick. Since a guitar amp chassis doesn't have mating surfaces like a pistol slide/frame, being thin is not really an advantage in an amp chassis application. Also, since the finish is so thin it doesn't hide metal work imperfections and is sensitive to spray gun technique. Thus, for an amp chassis I would stick with powdercoating.
TM
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Re: Silkscreen vs faceplates
I need to do white water slide decals & clear coat.
How do I make the decals?
Or do I need a printer?
Bob Simpson
How do I make the decals?
Or do I need a printer?
Bob Simpson
Please understand that IMO an answer to this question is of no practical relevance at all. - Max
Re: Silkscreen vs faceplates
I use a B&W laser printer from Brothers. Works great, you just need to get the right decal paper for the laser printer.
Ryan Brown
Brown Amplification LLC
Brown Amplification LLC
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Re: Silkscreen vs faceplates
Ok, got a stack of chassis painted and silkscreened. Fully outfitted with PEM nuts/studs/standoffs
Amplified Nation
www.amplifiednation.com
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Re: Silkscreen vs faceplates
Those look very professional.
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Re: Silkscreen vs faceplates
Amplified Nation
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Re: Silkscreen vs faceplates
I love the affordability of laser engraved plates. these 2 overdrive reverb plates cost me $16 each!
I got them from Label engraving company in South Carolina . Its made with Bur-Lane Series Acrylics
Cheers
Guy
I got them from Label engraving company in South Carolina . Its made with Bur-Lane Series Acrylics
Cheers
Guy
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Re: Silkscreen vs faceplates
I have them printed using Dye Sub inks on a flatbed printer. The kind that makes Aluminum signs. The sign company also laminates them. Neat thing is I can make different ones and different colors, anything really. I normally request .020. For just under $100 I can get a 4' x 4' sheet printed. I cut them to size using a table saw. This makes a lot of face and back plates.
This is how a lot or road signs are now made. The inks are tough and I prefer a matte laminate for a more dull look. They all look just as good as the day I installed them.
This is how a lot or road signs are now made. The inks are tough and I prefer a matte laminate for a more dull look. They all look just as good as the day I installed them.