which is better for lower volume cleans, Express or Liverpul

[Seemoore]

Ceriatone.
The Expression would be fitted with 6v6's.
I really don't know if I'd ever have the oppurtunity to crank the Liverpull to it's full capacity.

And by low volume cleans, I mean with a little edge, not completey clean.

Thanks in advance.

[marino]

I built liverpool with two el84 and two 6v6 switchable. I use mine 90 percent of time at low volume, until I find a better usage for this other than playing at home. In my opinion both have excellent cleans, but with agressive touch to it, very responsive, quite bright although with control knobs and bright switch you can do what ever you want. 6v6 is a bit softer, but still not really like fender deluxe or bassman. Maybe even unique sound but with a modern vibe. My opinion...For time being amplifier is coupled with 1x12 box with celestion G12H.

[Lonely Raven]

You might consider building a Trainwreck Rocket instead. It's pretty clean on most of the dial, and has that nice EL84 Chime.

I currently have a Rocket, Express, and I borrowed a local friends Liverpool (all clones, none original unfortunately). I felt the Express has a very dry EL-34 sound to it at lower volumes (which I like, not knocking it) and depending on the tubes can even get a bit woody. The Liverpool has a similiar sound with a bit of chime, but then the Rocket seems to be able to go from low volume chime to loud chime to loud, almost Marshall- midrange harmonically rich overdrive.

All three have great, harmonically rich cleans at lower volumes, but I feel the Rocket stands out.

This is all IMHO. Hopefully those with more experience than me can *chime* in and rebuke or verify what I feel about the three variants.

[mumford]

My ceriatone express doesn't do low volume at all, and it only has clean headroom with low output pickups. I love it, but it doesn't really do clean or quiet.

[El_Martin]

Hello seemore!

What volumes are you aiming at? Small clubs? Living room? Bedroom?
Even 15 Watts of a TW style amp into a single 12" guitar speaker will shake some souls in a house...
Good: you'll get to know your neighbours VERY soon
Bad: they probably bring some police with 'em

That's why a lot of guys install some voltage regulation for power reduction.

Ciao
Martin

[Seemoore]

Hello seemore!

What volumes are you aiming at? Small clubs? Living room? Bedroom?
Even 15 Watts of a TW style amp into a single 12" guitar speaker will shake some souls in a house...
Good: you'll get to know your neighbours VERY soon
Bad: they probably bring some police with 'em

That's why a lot of guys install some voltage regulation for power reduction.

Ciao
Martin

About the same volume as a Deluxe on 4, not much more than that.

I'll be using the amp in church.

[Blinkie]

The express liverpool or rocket can sound better at low volumes if you move the tubes around.


try a mullard in V3


Amperex bugle boy in V2

telefunken in V1 smooth or ribbed

be prepared to swap different ones of the same tube

[El_Martin]

Deluxe on 4...in churches...hmm...

If you want the TW sound, I'd go for a 15 W Liverpool and add Dana's (UR12) VVR to control the power.
Probabaly they'll expect you to turn it down a bit more and a concept with preamp distortion (see AX84, various higain pre's) and 6V6 PP would also fit the bill...or a Princeton w. Pedals.

Guess what I'm currently building? After some TWs and a 12W TurboChamp there's a Princeton variant on my bench

Ciao
Martin

[Seemoore]

Deluxe on 4...in churches...hmm...

If you want the TW sound, I'd go for a 15 W Liverpool and add Dana's (UR12) VVR to control the power.
Probabaly they'll expect you to turn it down a bit more and a concept with preamp distortion (see AX84, various higain pre's) and 6V6 PP would also fit the bill...or a Princeton w. Pedals.

Guess what I'm currently building? After some TWs and a 12W TurboChamp there's a Princeton variant on my bench

Ciao
Martin

My church has an orchestra with about 45 instruments, horns, strings, and such, think Trans Siberian Orchestra playing black spirituals kinda thing, and from the impression I get the TW would be almost perfect but, the music is also very dynamic and I need some soft time every now and then.
I've seen a few of Glens vids and it sounds like he can coach just about any sound he wants out of his amp, and I know, he has an original and I don't have his fingers.

I think the perfect amp would be a DRZ Maz 18 with a Trainwreck preamp.

Long time ago I had a Princeton reverb II, played that amp without pedals most of the time and it didn't matter, could get almost anything I needed from it, would love to have that one back.

[Seemoore]

Deluxe on 4...in churches...hmm...

If you want the TW sound, I'd go for a 15 W Liverpool and add Dana's (UR12) VVR to control the power.
Probabaly they'll expect you to turn it down a bit more and a concept with preamp distortion (see AX84, various higain pre's) and 6V6 PP would also fit the bill...or a Princeton w. Pedals.

Guess what I'm currently building? After some TWs and a 12W TurboChamp there's a Princeton variant on my bench

Ciao
Martin

My church has an orchestra with about 45 instruments, horns, strings, and such, think Trans Siberian Orchestra playing black spirituals kinda thing, and from the impression I get the TW would be almost perfect but, the music is also very dynamic and I need some soft time every now and then.
I've seen a few of Glens vids and it sounds like he can coach just about any sound he wants out of his amp, and I know, he has an original and I don't have his fingers.

I think the perfect amp would be a DRZ Maz 18 with a Trainwreck preamp.

Long time ago I had a Princeton reverb II, played that amp without pedals most of the time and it didn't matter, could get almost anything I needed from it, would love to have that one back.

[rooster]

The first EXP I built, I used the stock Tonesluts OT, rated at 35 watts. It was way too loud for my gigs sorry to say, although it is a good sounding amp. Then I built a second one with a Hammond 25 watt OT. Yeah, this works for me. It saturates a bit sooner, yes, but I have still done 3 outdoor gigs with it into a 4/12 without a problem, along with my weekly small club gigs. I typically use a 2/12 for indoors, FWIW, but remember that Glenn has figured out a 1/12 that works pretty well for him in small venues - using the larger OT and adjusting the impedance to get even less volume when he need to. He's obviously more clever than me...

I play 3-piece so I need to cover the rythmn and leads, as well. At first it was a bit difficult to balance things, potting down and all, but I am getting it. This was not my 'normal' approach to getting the job done, I might point out. (Ah, Glenn makes it look so easy, too!) I use a Barber LTD OD pedal for most of my soloing, BTW, which actually cleans up pretty nicely when you pot down. Which is a good thing to have in a pedal if you use pedals.... And, oh yeah, I am a Strat guy if I forgot to mention that.

So, anyway, not to bore you, but only to point out that the EXP - in my hands - is a different amp than it would be in Glenn's. I definitely dig it, but it may take some time and effort to make it do the things you want. For me it took dumbing the OT down a bit. Lastly, FWIW, where God is very COOL, I can honestly say that I cannnot think of too many churches that would be diggin' me playing my bigger EXP for the congragation ?? Eh, OK, my .02, YMMV. .........Oh, in Heaven they play 100 watt TWs all day.

[captain_rusty]

I've got a Ceriatone Liverpool, and the problem is that where it sounds great, it has to be loud. If you only want clean tones, maybe a different amp is the solution?
I use mine even at gigs with the speaker turned to the wall

[Abstract]

I've got a Ceriatone Liverpool, and the problem is that where it sounds great, it has to be loud. If you only want clean tones, maybe a different amp is the solution?
I use mine even at gigs with the speaker turned to the wall

+1

In my rehearsal space, I keep my speaker facing the wall about 8-10" out, at a slight angle.

I had to adjust it slightly brighter. Made it "bigger" sounding, less "point source".

[captain_rusty]

I've got a Ceriatone Liverpool, and the problem is that where it sounds great, it has to be loud. If you only want clean tones, maybe a different amp is the solution?
I use mine even at gigs with the speaker turned to the wall

+1

In my rehearsal space, I keep my speaker facing the wall about 8-10" out, at a slight angle.

I had to adjust it slightly brighter. Made it "bigger" sounding, less "point source".

Exactly! The amp (particularly with a Parker Fly) has so much treble to spare that you can keep the tone from getting at all muddy.
But there's no way this can be a satisfying "home use" amp for me - the wife would kill me