Help!! (Specifying an Express and can't decide on 6v6/EL34)

[Dave_5150]

Hello all,

After listening to a few spectacular demo's on youtube I've got the wreck bug.

I've recently had a year of using a H&K Switchblade & I realised that I was still using pretty much one sound, no effects and the guitar controls anyway so I guess an amp geared to do exactly that would be ideal for my style. As an aside I play classic rock 70's, 80's and 90's rock so I need sufficient gain on tap and I'm not keen on effects.

So far I've decided that I will definitely be having the build done by Nic at Ceriatone. I'm pretty much set on having the following features included PPMIV master volume, half power switch, external biasing points, multitapped primary OT, choke switch and a trim for the OD characteristic.

I'm about ready to place an order however I can't decide between the output tubes.

I like the idea of the lower output of the 6v6's. However I suspect the reality is it may still be too loud for both practice and pub gig's and I already have a trainwreck airbrake clone anyway.

I see that people here say EL34's sound british and 6v6's sound american but I could do with some examples of rock sounds of what each sound like in a wreck clone.

PS My theory with the half power and PPMIV was that I don't need to use them if I don't like how they sound. However if someone can convince me that them just been there and not being used would still significantly degrade the amp's tone then I may reconsider there inclusion as I have the airbrake clone anyway so they're not 100% needed. However they are very convenient!

Can anyone assist with my decision?


Dave

[Zippy]

It's a matter of personal preference - I like EL34s.

Why? I prefer the transition from clean to breakup and I prefer the tonal spectrum.

[racerx23]

hey Dave

I just tried 6V6's and went back to EL34's for more grunt, isn't that what a Trainwreck is all about after all.
The best compliment for this amp to controll it would be a VVR from Dana which keep your power tubes nice and saturated at lower volumes...perfect!

Regards, Craig.

[NowFender]

Posted this before....I have a ceriatone express I bought used with niks trannies and it was pretty aggressive, not bad but not for me. I changed to toneslut ot mallory od's and sprague electrolytics, also nos 6v6's and preamp tubes from the EL34's. I put in a ppimv for home use and use a 2-12 closed back w/celestion 50 watt speakers (I've had these for years). I've got my 4 track recorder and will do some clips soon...the difference to my ears is that the 34's when turned up was more marshall, the 6v6's turned up are more tweed bassman...I like the breakup characteristics with my goldtop and also my tele...Wouldn't have gotten it to this point without this forum! The ot made the most difference then the 6v6's...I also used a variac to breakin the new electrolytics which made the cleans sound more vintage for lack of terms...Hope it helps your decision.

[Dave_5150]

I think I decided having listened a lot recently to both the wreck mp3's that I found in the file section of this site and some other clips of wreck inspired amps (eg. fuchs train45 at the fuchsaudiotechnology website) that I will plump for the EL34's initially.

I guess the great thing about this decision is that it can always be changed relatively easily anyway.

I shall post back once I get the amp and figure out my sound

[dartanion]

If you are building an Express, you have the ability to run both EL34 and 6V6s, plus a bunch of other octals by re-biasing the amp for those tubes. Output impedance will be different for 6V6s, so adjust accordingly with your impedance selector.

[Buschman]

You can swap el34s and 6v6s without a re-bias. Look at the Trainwreck pages. The bias will not be optimal but it will work. I have tried both and as much as I wanted the 6v6s to work they just didn't do it for me. The seemed harsh and had a gritty top end to me. The el34s were more musical. The volume was different but not what you might expect. I do have a triode/pentode switch that is pretty usable but any MV that i tried has degraded the tone.

[dartanion]

Yeah, you can set the bias so it works for both tubes, but it's usually not optimal for either. As a rule, you should rebias every time you change power tubes, even in a cathode biased amp. Check the bias and adjust accordingly.