Mike Landau new dumble???

[groovtubin]

Not to get into this business discussion but I would consider the Skyline tone stack.. implementation of the R/J switch and the topology of the OD circuit unique and innovative.. I suppose one could argue certain parts he used ie pots/resistors and cap choice has been used in other amps but his ability to find right combination or recipe of certain parts in key spots implemented that yielded such a tone is also very innovative, very time consuming and IMHO a big part of his genius for the time, since not many others went as deep..If any of this matters to others..

Tony

OH YEAH MAN, WHAT A TOPOLOGY!

jp

[ToneMerc]

Maybe he is bipolar.... Who knows.

I have many more tales, some much worse than fairly benign tale above. And Andy is correct about "Bob" on ampgarage. He has owned 6 Dumbles and is a close friend and lives near me. He has had many a run-in as has his friend who also ordered an amp (like 20 years ago).

Scott, I know and I bet I have story that might top the "tales" you have heard. Nevertheless, I'm having to keep my mouth shut.

Mike

[ampdork]

Your own battle with ethics and morals determine if and when you will issue an apology

Right.... and as a pirate and bootlegger I am quite free of these hang ups.
I feel no need to bullshit myself into thinking I am a saint.
I have stolen from the mans body of work and I make no bones about it.



Scott....glad you decided to self edit.



Again this is totally sideways to the Landau content...

Let's argue about that instead.... The clips I have not heard sucked.

Are there any recordings around yet?

[dreric]

It's clear that the rumors of HAD's business practices demonstrate an eccentric nature. (and unless one speaks from the first person they are just rumors)

As a business man providing a product HAD's eccentricity and practices create a mystique which EVERYONE has profited from. The man literally created the boutique amplifier industry. But even if a fraction of the rumors are true his business practices are bizzar

Rather than perpetuate the idolization or psychoanalysis of HAD I'd like to offer a different perspective.

If one looks as HAD not as a business man but rather as an artist his behavior and practices become more a matter of artistic entitlement. Still eccentric, but artists are supposed to be eccentric so we forgive them. Their talent for creating art which moves one on an emotional level creates tolerance for the pain in the ass they tend to be.

From what I can see I'd say that HAD most likely thinks of himself as an artist rather than a business.

Eric

[CHIP]

Good point.

[Max]

Hi all,

may I ask why some members here seem to think that it is of importance to find out if Alexander Dumble is more like Mother Theresa, Charles Manson, Albert Einstein or Vincent van Gogh?

Do they - from a more practical perspective - think that the members here should be warned not to send their builds to Alexander Dumble for an evaluation concerning how close they are in his opinion to his original designs or for some service or an HRM mod - or even not to order a SSS "clone" made by Alexander Dumble himself?

Or do they - from a more ethical perspective - perhaps feel bad to build Dumble clones without being sure if his character is more like the one of Gandalf or more like the one of Saruman - or what is this discussion all about?

Why do some here think that his behavior urgently needs to be judged by the members of the Amp Garage forum? Do they think that at some future day someone at heaven's gates perhaps will need our advice concerning if he should let him in? Or is all this just some kind of Wisteria Lane gossip for boys - or what's going on?

Cheers,

Max

[bluesfendermanblues]

Good point Max,

Lets remove focus from the person/artist/scientist/ H. Alexander Dumble and focus on his work.

This is how any person/artist/scientist should be judged.....not so much focus on the person behind the art (we are all just small people anyway), and more focus on the art/amp created.

IME, a lot of famous 'great people' are not so great, once you get to know them.

Therefore, I say 'respect for the big guys work'

[59Pro]

Shad, since you asked, Scottl knows a guy very well Bob (his last name escapes me, senior moment), but he's in the Philly area. Bob has corresponded with and knows personally, a number of people who have been victimized. He bought, sold and owned many Dumbles, and has times,dates, and names to back some of this up. It's not posted without being based in reality. It's up to Scott and/or Bob (whom I think may belong to this forum) if they want to rehash these old events. Scott has also talked with many D- owners who related their horror stories about getting their amps delivered or repaired.

As far as the morality: Many customers brought amps to me, Billy Yates, Paul Rivera, and other techs, because they had bad experiences with HAD or didn't want to chance never seeing an amp again. The information started to leak out, in-part because it was forced out.

I had two customers Sean Gillan and Carlos Rivera who had bizarre dealings they shared: Sean needed to go the LAPD to get him to deliver the amp he flew to California (from Long Island) to pick up. When he called from LA to get it (after being told it was done), the excuses started....when the police got involved the amp was suddenly delivered on a Moped. "Here's your amp...see ya"... Carlos owned two Dumble amps ( "one to play and one to be repaired.." his words not mine). Sold them both and was later harassed by Howard in person, for buying a few of mine...."Hey how are those amps I made ?". "Sold them bought a few Fuchs'...". Howie freaked.

These sillly contracts notwithstanding, the customer service end of his business has always been bizarre (and that's being kind). None of this stuff would hold up in court anyway. Whats more foolish, the guy who'd actually signed and accepted one of these contracts and gave him cash, or the guy who thinks he could get away with saying his customers knew they'd be dealing with a guy like this from the start ? I suspect a judge would have some stern words for both parties.

Andy Brauer told me he had to stop selling them because "lead times got longer and longer, deposits got bigger and bigger, and the sound constantly changed from unit to unit, and my customers got angrier and angrier". His irrationality is typified by a sweet guy like Dean waiting years to get an amp back, while other name artists got amps repaired, new amps delivered (some wired enough to work, but not complete) , and other customers got alienated or simply gave up on dealing with him.

At this point, what difference does it really make ? You seem obsessed with picking at this scab, and at this point it seems a moot point.

You judge Alexander Dumble's business practice?
I really wonder about YOUR business ethics. You repeatably post here about bad rumors and stories regarding Dumble. All your stories are not first hand, I would be interesting to hear the other side (Dumble's side). Why do you need to bad mouth Dumble? What do you gain from it? Do you know Alexander personally or you just ...heard and read..?

I know Alexander since several years now and have three amps from him, two of them I ordered directly from him. That "famous" contract never showed up, I never had to sign anything. It was all done by handshake. He is one nice and funny person. Very professional and the amps he made for me always exceeded my expectations. He is a one man operation, he does it all himself. One knows when you order an amp it will not be done in a month or two. I got both my amps faster than my first two guitar orders from the Fender Custom Shop and I was always happy with the delivery from the Fender CS.

In the years I know him he has been always very selective choosing his customer's. Maybe because of some bad or bizarre behavior he experienced from the customer side. For sure not all customers, including famous people, are saints either. There are always two sides to the stories. I got treated very well in all these years doing business with Alexander.

[CHIP]

Hi all,

may I ask why some members here seem to think that it is of importance to find out if Alexander Dumble is more like Mother Theresa, Charles Manson, Albert Einstein or Vincent van Gogh?

Do they - from a more practical perspective - think that the members here should be warned not to send their builds to Alexander Dumble for an evaluation concerning how close they are in his opinion to his original designs or for some service or an HRM mod - or even not to order a SSS "clone" made by Alexander Dumble himself?

Or do they - from a more ethical perspective - perhaps feel bad to build Dumble clones without being sure if his character is more like the one of Gandalf or more like the one of Saruman - or what is this discussion all about?

Why do some here think that his behavior urgently needs to be judged by the members of the Amp Garage forum? Do they think that at some future day someone at heaven's gates perhaps will need our advice concerning if he should let him in? Or is all this just some kind of Wisteria Lane gossip for boys - or what's going on?

Cheers,

Max

Ethically speaking,IMHO there's a huge difference between one who clones an amp for personal use and one who sells a cloned amp.
For instance;
Everyone knows when you purchase a recording you can copy it as many times as you like, as long as you don't intend to sell.

[Max]

Everyone knows when you purchase a recording you can copy it as many times as you like, as long as you don't intend to sell.

Chip, so before copying it for your personal use you at first purchased an original custom made Dumble amp from Alexander Dumble? Or did I misunderstand something in your post?

Cheers,

Max

[erwin_ve]

Everyone knows when you purchase a recording you can copy it as many times as you like, as long as you don't intend to sell.

Chip, so before copying it for your personal use you at first purchased an original custom made Dumble amp from Alexander Dumble? Or did I misunderstand something in your post?

Cheers,

Max

Lol Max, you're a killer

[Structo]

All I have to say is if Alexander's amps aren't innovative, why do they garner the attention they do?
Why do they sound the way they do?
Why do a large majority of people find them pleasing to play and listen to on recordings?

Because they are like no other amplifier.

Maybe he didn't invent the separate circuits but he combined them in a way I don't think anybody else did for years.

Take Lindley's slide sound. Nobody came close to that sound for years, if even still.
It was instantly recognizable even before Jackson Brown opened his mouth who it was.

Robben, Larry, several others have a signature sound with these amps.

I for one am glad I borrowed a bit from the big guy to find a little pleasure to my life.

Not sure I could honestly make a living from it though.

[bluesfendermanblues]

Ethical dilemma:

We are all (Dumble) cannibals, but are the pros (TwoRock, Fuchs) worse than the amateurs?? IMO No, not really.

Personally, I would never pay 50,000 USD for an old amp - perhaps for an old Ferrari or Dodge Viper, but not an amp - nor would I accept waiting for years on end to get what I had paid for.

So if I wasn't able to build an amp myself, I would probably buy a Fuchs, TwoRock, Redplate, Bludo, Carol-Ann or a (finished) Ceriatone. These amps run at 1,500-3,000 USD and fill a spot in the marketplace consisting of players like me .......that H. Alexander Dumble would never support.

This is a great forum, despite the occational bickering.

[FUCHSAUDIO]

What do you gain from it? Do you know Alexander personally or you just ...heard and read..?

I know Alexander since several years now and have three amps from him, two of them I ordered directly from him. That "famous" contract never showed up, I never had to sign anything. It was all done by handshake. He is one nice and funny person. Very professional and the amps he made for me always exceeded my expectations. He is a one man operation, he does it all himself. One knows when you order an amp it will not be done in a month or two. I got both my amps faster than my first two guitar orders from the Fender Custom Shop and I was always happy with the delivery from the Fender CS.

In the years I know him he has been always very selective choosing his customer's. Maybe because of some bad or bizarre behavior he experienced from the customer side. For sure not all customers, including famous people, are saints either. There are always two sides to the stories. I got treated very well in all these years doing business with Alexander.

59: Yes, I have actually had personal contact with HAD, and it was at times cordial, and at time abusive, rude and bizzarre. Perhaps 25/30 years ago, i worked at a company that made high end audio equipment with tubes. We discussed making guitar amps, since we were tooled up to do tube based manufacturing anyway. So, my boss says "maybe we could license a design from someone". I called and left a few messages about actually making an amp based on his design (never called back...), and offering to help by being an east coast service person (hmmm, never called back). Oh well...

When I came on the scene a few years back (around '99) the owner of a local amp repair shop (Dave's Sound) called me to tell me HAD called him to find out more about "this guy from Jersey". That was '99. Apparently Dave had serviced a Dumbles and called Howard for support, so they knew one another...

Have I gained anything ? Nope. More than likely I've actually LOST some business when he's forced customers to sell their Fuchs amps before he would release the ones he'd built for them. I've only passed along things I've heard from people I trusted (in some cases my actual customers), and more times than not they proved true. Some of the stories that came up from people during the writing of the Dumble book were nothing short of amazing, but nobody wanted to allow them to be published. He'd actually convinced most of his customers to not speak with the writer, who is a respected journalist who spoke with many of these people before.

You don't find it bizarre that he's abandoned many of his best known customers, kept another guys amp without a valid reason, yet you "got treated very well.." ?

We could debate this all day, why not get back on track and discuss Landau's new amp ?

[butwhatif]

all the accomplished players mentioned had a 'signature sound' long before d amps came about. perhaps this forum might mislead many on that issue. everyone knows players that have no 'sig sound' but the 'best rig' in the world. larry had his sound down when he played w/ the crusaders in the '70s. he and others sounded great playing thru many diff amps. there are other means to get the d tone, particularly out of smaller tube amps. in the studio there are soo many ways to get a great tone, but lots of people don't try, or don't even listen.
AD took the request of others to amplify the tones gotten from their fav small amps and made it controllable, while borrowing as much as anyone from the work of others, and then promoted his+their work to the best players he could find, just like Leo, Randall, and a host of others did.