ijedouglas wrote: ↑Sat Apr 26, 2025 9:46 pm
I have yet to see a real ODS with F&T caps in it, yet we keep seeing folks put them in their amps and expect them to sound like the real thing....
One of the most famous ODS's of all time has F&T's in it. I know we talked about this recently but I figured I would get others opinions on it as well and this seems like a decent place to post this photo of none other than Robben Ford's #102 (found right here on TAG)
I know the contention is that Ruby's are not F&T's but the labeling is the same and it's even in German still (Typ A)
I have also posted a photo of some F&T's that were purchased back in 2022 ish (before F&T was sold possibly?) and they have the same German spelling of Type (Typ)
I presume that since Ruby doesn't actually make anything they ordered caps for their purposes? They are made by F&T because why would Ruby have German spelling on their cap labeling? From videos I've watched of electrolytic cap manufacturing they usually just apply the labeling sleeve in-house so that means it's being applied where it's being made. Anyone with any more insight I would love to know more. One thing to note, there is a different, potentially non-F&T Ruby cap in 102 as well. At the bottom we can see a different capacitor labeling style so that might back up what others have just said here about mixing types.
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ijedouglas wrote: ↑Sat Apr 26, 2025 9:46 pm
I have yet to see a real ODS with F&T caps in it, yet we keep seeing folks put them in their amps and expect them to sound like the real thing....
One of the most famous ODS's of all time has F&T's in it. I know we talked about this recently but I figured I would get others opinions on it as well and this seems like a decent place to post this photo of none other than Robben Ford's #102 (found right here on TAG)
I know the contention is that Ruby's are not F&T's but the labeling is the same and it's even in German still (Typ A)
I have also posted a photo of some F&T's that were purchased back in 2022 ish (before F&T was sold possibly?) and they have the same German spelling of Type (Typ)
I presume that since Ruby doesn't actually make anything they ordered caps for their purposes? They are made by F&T because why would Ruby have German spelling on their cap labeling? From videos I've watched of electrolytic cap manufacturing they usually just apply the labeling sleeve in-house so that means it's being applied where it's being made. Anyone with any more insight I would love to know more. One thing to note, there is a different, potentially non-F&T Ruby cap in 102 as well. At the bottom we can see a different capacitor labeling style so that might back up what others have just said here about mixing types.
Ruby Gold is manufactured by Rubycon (Japan). F&T is manufactured by Mersen (Germany). NOT THE SAME....
ijedouglas wrote: ↑Sat Apr 26, 2025 9:46 pm
I have yet to see a real ODS with F&T caps in it, yet we keep seeing folks put them in their amps and expect them to sound like the real thing....
One of the most famous ODS's of all time has F&T's in it. I know we talked about this recently but I figured I would get others opinions on it as well and this seems like a decent place to post this photo of none other than Robben Ford's #102 (found right here on TAG)
I know the contention is that Ruby's are not F&T's but the labeling is the same and it's even in German still (Typ A)
I have also posted a photo of some F&T's that were purchased back in 2022 ish (before F&T was sold possibly?) and they have the same German spelling of Type (Typ)
I presume that since Ruby doesn't actually make anything they ordered caps for their purposes? They are made by F&T because why would Ruby have German spelling on their cap labeling? From videos I've watched of electrolytic cap manufacturing they usually just apply the labeling sleeve in-house so that means it's being applied where it's being made. Anyone with any more insight I would love to know more. One thing to note, there is a different, potentially non-F&T Ruby cap in 102 as well. At the bottom we can see a different capacitor labeling style so that might back up what others have just said here about mixing types.
Ruby Gold is manufactured by Rubycon (Japan). F&T is manufactured by Mersen. NOT THE SAME....
Yeah I agree that the bottom cap is different but the other two have German writing on them and follow the labeling convention seen in my own photo of my own F&T's. F&T was a German company and was sold to Mersen late 2010's (2019 something like that). The writing on those caps in #102 are in German (Typ A) so I think it's safe to assume that the cap that is obviously very different in labeling in that photo is Rubycon and the other two with German writing on them are F&T. The caps in #102 may be before F&T was sold to Mersen in the late 2010's but they were German regardless so I think while they have Ruby logos on all 3 caps (HAD may have just sourced all 3 of them from Ruby) only 2 of them are F&T manufactured
EDIT: of note, according to google translate Typ is also Type in French (Mersen is a French company). I have no idea if Mersen uprooted the FTCAP plant and moved it to France but that seems like a poor business decision. Anyone who knows can chime in if the caps are still made in FT's plant in Germany or wherever they were originally made. I assume if they're made in the same place then the labeling remains the same regardless of parent company language differences. No matter, they say Typ on them and that is a dead giveaway that they're not Rubycons
Last edited by pottedplant on Sun Apr 27, 2025 12:10 am, edited 1 time in total.
award70 wrote: ↑Wed Apr 23, 2025 3:45 pm
What does "grainy" sound like and what might cause this?
Alan
I’m not trying to be a smartass or start anything….I would like to know.
Harsh, irritating especially in the high end, definition and clarity lacks up top and doesn't sing , high end harmonic feedback also subsequently sounds terrible and screechy, causes ear fatigue, makes you want to turn down or turn off your amplifier, and anticipate the end of the gig or rehearsal.
I see. I have F&Ts in some and Spagues in others. Maybe I’ll get some Nichicons to compare. Thanks for the info.
67plexi wrote: ↑Sun Apr 27, 2025 12:26 am
I didn't care for the sound of F&T's in my first ODS build 2010 switched to precision type PS in my builds from that point on
amp 0001.JPG
Pretty much anything has sounded better than the F&Ts
ijedouglas wrote: ↑Sat Apr 26, 2025 9:46 pm
I have yet to see a real ODS with F&T caps in it, yet we keep seeing folks put them in their amps and expect them to sound like the real thing....
One of the most famous ODS's of all time has F&T's in it. I know we talked about this recently but I figured I would get others opinions on it as well and this seems like a decent place to post this photo of none other than Robben Ford's #102 (found right here on TAG)
I know the contention is that Ruby's are not F&T's but the labeling is the same and it's even in German still (Typ A)
I have also posted a photo of some F&T's that were purchased back in 2022 ish (before F&T was sold possibly?) and they have the same German spelling of Type (Typ)
I presume that since Ruby doesn't actually make anything they ordered caps for their purposes? They are made by F&T because why would Ruby have German spelling on their cap labeling? From videos I've watched of electrolytic cap manufacturing they usually just apply the labeling sleeve in-house so that means it's being applied where it's being made. Anyone with any more insight I would love to know more. One thing to note, there is a different, potentially non-F&T Ruby cap in 102 as well. At the bottom we can see a different capacitor labeling style so that might back up what others have just said here about mixing types.
Ruby Gold is manufactured by Rubycon (Japan). F&T is manufactured by Mersen (Germany). NOT THE SAME....
The logo on the ruby caps in #102 is the same as the ruby tubes logo. Are Ruby Tubes and Rubycon the same company? If not then how can you be sure who manufactured them?
One of the most famous ODS's of all time has F&T's in it. I know we talked about this recently but I figured I would get others opinions on it as well and this seems like a decent place to post this photo of none other than Robben Ford's #102 (found right here on TAG)
I know the contention is that Ruby's are not F&T's but the labeling is the same and it's even in German still (Typ A)
I have also posted a photo of some F&T's that were purchased back in 2022 ish (before F&T was sold possibly?) and they have the same German spelling of Type (Typ)
I presume that since Ruby doesn't actually make anything they ordered caps for their purposes? They are made by F&T because why would Ruby have German spelling on their cap labeling? From videos I've watched of electrolytic cap manufacturing they usually just apply the labeling sleeve in-house so that means it's being applied where it's being made. Anyone with any more insight I would love to know more. One thing to note, there is a different, potentially non-F&T Ruby cap in 102 as well. At the bottom we can see a different capacitor labeling style so that might back up what others have just said here about mixing types.
Ruby Gold is manufactured by Rubycon (Japan). F&T is manufactured by Mersen (Germany). NOT THE SAME....
The logo on the ruby caps in #102 is the same as the ruby tubes logo. Are Ruby Tubes and Rubycon the same company? If not then how can you be sure who manufactured them?
look at the text on the odd one out, the gold is richer and the font is thicker. the black is also much darker than the other 2's. I can't say rubycon made that odd one out but it's definitely NOT made by the same people who made the other 2 black caps that have the same tone of black and writing on them.
edit: ruby tubes (the logo you're seeing) do not make anything, they put their logo on stuff they sell. it seems to me that they got F&T and Rubycon (maybe?) to make caps for them and as you can see because they're made by two completely different companies with two completely different labeling machines they have different fonts
Last edited by pottedplant on Sun Apr 27, 2025 12:45 am, edited 1 time in total.
Ruby Gold is manufactured by Rubycon (Japan). F&T is manufactured by Mersen (Germany). NOT THE SAME....
The logo on the ruby caps in #102 is the same as the ruby tubes logo. Are Ruby Tubes and Rubycon the same company? If not then how can you be sure who manufactured them?
look at the text on the odd one out, the gold is richer and the font is thicker. the black is also much darker than the other 2's. I can't say rubycon made that odd one out but it's definitely NOT made by the same people who made the other 2 black caps that have the same tone of black and writing on them.
My understanding is that they are made by Rubycon in Japan. I can't be sure and I honestly don't care... I do know that I have tried both the Ruby Gold and F&T and they are not the same.
The logo on the ruby caps in #102 is the same as the ruby tubes logo. Are Ruby Tubes and Rubycon the same company? If not then how can you be sure who manufactured them?
look at the text on the odd one out, the gold is richer and the font is thicker. the black is also much darker than the other 2's. I can't say rubycon made that odd one out but it's definitely NOT made by the same people who made the other 2 black caps that have the same tone of black and writing on them.
My understanding is that they are made by Rubycon in Japan. I can't be sure and I honestly don't care... I do know that I have tried both the Ruby Gold and F&T and they are not the same.
Well there are clearly 2 different "ruby golds" offered by or have been offered by Ruby. You can see the plastic is less black on the F&T made ones. In the non zoomed in photo of 102 you can see the 2 F&T's sticking out like a sore thumb because of the duller black plastic labeling. To me the rich black/gold one is definitely a different manufacturer and it kinda looks like Rubycon's font so you are likely right
pottedplant wrote: ↑Sun Apr 27, 2025 12:40 am
look at the text on the odd one out, the gold is richer and the font is thicker. the black is also much darker than the other 2's. I can't say rubycon made that odd one out but it's definitely NOT made by the same people who made the other 2 black caps that have the same tone of black and writing on them.
My understanding is that they are made by Rubycon in Japan. I can't be sure and I honestly don't care... I do know that I have tried both the Ruby Gold and F&T and they are not the same.
Well there are clearly 2 different "ruby golds" offered by or have been offered by Ruby. You can see the plastic is less black on the F&T made ones. In the non zoomed in photo of 102 you can see the 2 F&T's sticking out like a sore thumb because of the duller black plastic labeling. To me the rich black/gold one is definitely a different manufacturer and it kinda looks like Rubycon's font so you are likely right
ijedouglas wrote: ↑Sun Apr 27, 2025 12:43 am
My understanding is that they are made by Rubycon in Japan. I can't be sure and I honestly don't care... I do know that I have tried both the Ruby Gold and F&T and they are not the same.
Well there are clearly 2 different "ruby golds" offered by or have been offered by Ruby. You can see the plastic is less black on the F&T made ones. In the non zoomed in photo of 102 you can see the 2 F&T's sticking out like a sore thumb because of the duller black plastic labeling. To me the rich black/gold one is definitely a different manufacturer and it kinda looks like Rubycon's font so you are likely right
I'm out....
If you like F&T use em....
I was agreeing with you and saying that some of those caps are not F&T and that you are likely right in saying it's Rubycon
My least preferred Dumble amplifier of all time. If those are F&T then that tracks, not that they are of course. I always assumed it had been recapped at some point though, it being 40 years old or so at this point. the tone shifts around a bit over the years to my ears, but never really my cup of tea in any case
WhopperPlate wrote: ↑Sun Apr 27, 2025 1:58 am
My least preferred Dumble amplifier of all time. If those are F&T then that tracks, not that they are of course. I always assumed it had been recapped at some point though, it being 40 years old or so at this point. the tone shifts around a bit over the years to my ears, but never really my cup of tea in any case
that's totally fair, i agree it's a unique tone for sure and there's a good possibility those caps weren't installed by Dumble. The amp is still a great amp though from most people's experiences when they talk about playing it. I do know that 100% for a fact Dumble used F&T's in the Rich Mcdonald Tweedle Dee. There's no speculation there because the amp is very likely untouched. I'm not sure if me observing things is not okay here but I thought this was a discussion forum. I seem to be running into this problem a few times. Am I doing something wrong here? I observe there is a difference between those 2 caps and the other cap and I get my head taken off? Anyhow I love the sound of your amps so you definitely know good caps.
pottedplant wrote: ↑Sun Apr 27, 2025 9:13 am
I'm not sure if me observing things is not okay here but I thought this was a discussion forum. I seem to be running into this problem a few times. Am I doing something wrong here? I observe there is a difference between those 2 caps and the other cap and I get my head taken off? Anyhow I love the sound of your amps so you definitely know good caps.
Are you serious?? No one "took your head off"..... Nothing wrong in you observing and discussing but when you start arguing ad infinitum it starts to get stale. Whether #102 has F&Ts or not, there was a question about general use vs audio grade caps and a few comments were made about F&Ts. I (along with others) have tried them in ODS amps and found them horrible. My statement stands.... if you like them, use them.
