Surprised at the "honk" heard in new G10 Vintage speakers

[pjd3]

Hello,

Has anyone ever dealt with new Celestion G10 Vintage speakers?

Reason I ask is that I just purchased two of them for a stereo plexi pedal platform gigging amp. I had heard all of the descriptions, that is partly a 10" version of the V30 with the same kind of voice coil design but, since if is a 10" it will not sound exactly like a V30. I was fine with that description and was happy to live with that. Also, I understood that these speakers have a reputation for requiring a good hearty break in time to come into their own. I was fine with that, too.

But, I am surprised to hear a very prevelant honk, a very reedy aspect to the tone that I would say lives around 1Khz, 2Khz. I have been playing out with a V30 and rather like what that speaker has been giving me, upper mid emphasis and all, but, this emphasis in the G10 Vintage i'm finding is very overwhelming. I'm disapointed at this point as its a bit painful to think of living through a break in period with this.

There are many comments online about this and some say that once these speakers are broken in, that mid emphasis with relax and widen, the low end with bloom and the highs will become sweeter and less strident. But then of course, there are opinions that say if you don't like what you are hearing when the speaker is new, then you probably wont like it even when its broken in.

I guess I'm ready to replace them with something else but, would like to hear any experience with these speakers to shed light on any false expectations.

These speakers sounded "good on paper" but, yeah, we know how that goes.

Thanks!
Best
Phil D.

[Geeze]

Sorry Phil, I have not experience with these. I do wonder does a speaker break in or does our ear surrender?

Russ

[pjd3]

Ha, right Geeze.

It was a long and tedious venture building this stereo amp, and I can't compromise on speaker choice. I would bit my tounqe if I thought these speakers would level out a bit over time but, this honk is just so apparent right now. Although the V30's are toted for the high mid emphasis that I know may people hate, I just never heard it in the V30's to a point that was a put off. I like balance in a speaker so, I know this is very prevalent in these 10" speakers.

I might just buy up a couple of Creamback 10's or Greenback 10's. They both sounded pretty good in a comparison video I heard. The G10 Vintage was one of the speakers in the comparison but, I did not hear this honk going on in the vid. But I do hear a couple of others speak of it.

Thanks
Phil D

[sluckey]

You have a lot of time invested in this amp. Probably gonna take a long time to pair it with speakers you like. Buying speakers based on what you read or hear on the net is always gonna be a gamble. Consider buying from Amazon. Buy'em, try'em, return'em. Repeat until you're happy.

[Snicksound]

I have done some speaker comparison on my 1x10 combo and... The G10 Vintage did not win. In fact I preferred the cheaper VT Jr to it (the speaker that Marshall puts in their more expensive 1x10 combos)

It does NOT sound like a V30, at all (and yes mine is old and broken in).

The G10 Creamback eventually stayed in the cab, but it was only marginally better than the VT Jr.

The G10 Vintage is not bad for clean only though.

(This is a 5W JCM800-ish combo with a single ECC99 power tube)

[Snicksound]

You have a lot of time invested in this amp. Probably gonna take a long time to pair it with speakers you like. Buying speakers based on what you read or hear on the net is always gonna be a gamble. Consider buying from Amazon. Buy'em, try'em, return'em. Repeat until you're happy.

Totally! My little 5W 1x10 combo started as a "cheap project for playing at home", but by the time I was done I had spent so much time on it (even designed my own PCB) it didn't make sense to not get the best speaker for it

[Roe]

I'm happy with the g10 vintage and g10 gold combo in a 4x10

[pjd3]

Hi Roe,

I did listen to a couple of vids with a mating of the G10 Vintage and another speaker, and liked the results of the combination. In one of these he also did separate clips of each speaker alone, and I did not hear the "honk-ish" thing I hear in mine.

One ruminating thought, that I doubt is true, is that I did use Vishay MKT1813 polyester film caps for both the bright cap and the EQ treble cap just as a starter point. The presence and treble are turned up much more on these amps than the last amp I built with silver mica bright and treble caps.

Could my inclusion of the polyester film caps in bright and treble positions be creating a condition for the "honky" thing? Just a thought.

Best, and thanks,
Phil D

[Roe]

Hi Roe,

I did listen to a couple of vids with a mating of the G10 Vintage and another speaker, and liked the results of the combination. In one of these he also did separate clips of each speaker alone, and I did not hear the "honk-ish" thing I hear in mine.

One ruminating thought, that I doubt is true, is that I did use Vishay MKT1813 polyester film caps for both the bright cap and the EQ treble cap just as a starter point. The presence and treble are turned up much more on these amps than the last amp I built with silver mica bright and treble caps.

Could my inclusion of the polyester film caps in bright and treble positions be creating a condition for the "honky" thing? Just a thought.

Best, and thanks,
Phil D

try at least 40-50 hours of break in before you decide anything. hit them with power and bass

[pjd3]

I'd be happy to do that but, that's going to be a difficult thing to do without someone wanting to kill me!

I'll see what I can do.

Perhaps set my sig generator for a square wave sweep and cover the speaker cab in layers of comforters and bed spreads.

Phil

[Geeze]

Hi Phil,

One thing that keeps poking me in the head - have you had speakers in the cab that sounded good - AKA no honk or excessive mids?

Russ

[pjd3]

Nope. Brand newly built cab, the G10's in there for the first time. I have nothing to compare it too.

I am going to just play the things out for a bunch of gigs and see if there is any difference over some time. I won't hold my breath but, I'll give it a chance. I'm still sounding good with the band, its just a notable annoyance to me. there was going to be 2 V30's in the cab but, I didnt initially allow enough room between speaker magnet and tubes/transformers - just too close for comfort.

Phil

[Geeze]

Nope. Brand newly built cab, the G10's in there for the first time. I have nothing to compare it too.
Phil

The reason I ask is I built a 1936 with poplar that was 3" shorter than standard - the owner complained of excessive mids. I'd built them this size in padauk and - if I remember correctly - maple and I didn't notice this. The owner tried several sets of non mids speakers until he found some that worked.

Russ

[pjd3]

That's interesting.

It hadn't occurred to me that the cab dimensions could have an impact in that way. This amp is a Twin reverb size cab with an open back, and is made from pine.

I wonder if experimenting with acoustic material lined inside the cab could highlight if there are frequency related effects do to cab dimension or, being pine.

Thanks very letting me know that. Hmm.

Best,
Phil

Also, I could try something like a pair of Creamback 10's. I kind of liked them quite a bit in the demos, british but seemed fairly versatile for tones. There were some reports of some "honk" heard in the G10 vintages but, I didn't hear that in a few of the decently done videos'

[Geeze]

I'd do some serious experimenting on this before I spent any $$$. I've read over the years ago changing the volume inside the speaker enclosure - primarily on closed back - but I wonder if it would affect the open back? A couple of hard back books in the bottom perhaps. The other - completely rando but that's how my brain works - run a long clamp from side to side and then from top to bottom while playing to see if low level resonance is occurring.

Yes this is grasping straws but it doesn't cost anything.

Russ